Extinguishers banned as a fire safety hazard

[The Colonel]

Interesting happenings in Bournmouth where fire extinguishers have been removed from communal areas of flats as they are a safety hazard. Interesting inview of some comments in threads on the forum.

Have a look and see what they say at
http://www.metro.co.uk/news/article.html?in_article_id=115014&in_page_id=34

[jasper]

Numpties?

[Paul2886]

Interesting eh. There's nothing new about the decision to remove or omit fire extinguishers from communal areas in flats. If a resident wishes to deal with a fire within their flat then they can provide one for themselves. Modern building regs will ensure a protected route to safety in the event of fire and of course a fire risk assessment should flag up the need, should there be one, and I doubt it, for fire extinguishers on landings etc. That's me, but what do you think?

[Midland Retty]

Nothing new in this at all. I havent seen fire extinguishers in the communal areas of flats for yonks.

Problems with vandalism and untrained residents trying to fight fire were the reason they removed in our county.

[kurnal]

Agree with Paul M there was probably never a requirement for the extinguishers its just a shame that the reason to justify  their removal has become so distorted.
I find the elf and safety lobby against the provision of extinguishers incredible. They look on a piece of safety equipment as potentially a hazard and yet support the retail sale of petrol, fireworks, matches, LPG, acetylene cylinders to members of the public without any particular control over how they are used or stored.

Its a bit like the sale of respiratory person protective equipment. Anyone can go into into B&Q and buy a sander or grinder. There is a risk that someone will use the wrong type of mask for the hazard they are about to create and cause themselves harm- and yet the elf and safety lobby dont campaign to stop the sale of dustmasks to untrained people in case they use the wrong one and hurt themselves.

[Paul2886]

Agree with Paul M there was probably never a requirement for the extinguishers its just a shame that the reason to justify  their removal has become so distorted.
I find the elf and safety lobby against the provision of extinguishers incredible. They look on a piece of safety equipment as potentially a hazard and yet support the retail sale of petrol, fireworks, matches, LPG, acetylene cylinders to members of the public without any particular control over how they are used or stored.

Its a bit like the sale of respiratory person protective equipment. Anyone can go into into B&Q and buy a sander or grinder. There is a risk that someone will use the wrong type of mask for the hazard they are about to create and cause themselves harm- and yet the elf and safety lobby dont campaign to stop the sale of dustmasks to untrained people in case they use the wrong one and hurt themselves.

Kurnal...Such a wise head on a young shoulder (well maybe). Well said, my sentiments completely

[wee brian]

This comes back to the good old sleeping guide and the confusion amongst Risk Assessors about fire precautions in flats.

There's a fair number of people who are doing FRAs in the common parts of flats and providing extinguishers. I expect a few of them sell extinguishers but lets not go down that route.

I think a few Brigades are/have also recomended extinguishers (cos they get confused too).

So the decision that is in the news is to remove extinguishers that people have only just started putting in!

Good here isn't it.

[The Reiver]

Should retailers now stop selling fire extinguishers to house, car, caravan, boat owners etc. because said owner is not trained to use it ?

Should internet sellers be allowed to trade in fire extinguishers without viewing the buyers training certificate of competancy ?

Should I allow myself to use a fire extinguisher in a fire situation ?
I'm a certificated service technician, therefore I know how they work.
I run live fire training sessions for commerce and industry, therefore I've used them.
But am I trained enough to actually put a proper fire out in a life threatening situation ?

I have just risk assessed myself. I am so inadequate. Oh God what shall I do ?

I am now so worried and will now look for another career.
Maybe these guys:

Ice cream toppings a health and safety risk
31 January 2008

The Italian ice cream chain "Morellis" banned staff from putting toppings on customers' ice creams in case they slipped over them if they dripped off.  Instead customers received the cone with the topping in a separate pot to pour on themselves.

At least I won't now fire dry powder into my face. I'll just end up getting assaulted by a spoon full of hundreds and thousands. :rolleyes:

[wee brian]

OK dude - I hear you. I think what the issue here is

Should we require (by force of law) fire extinguishers in the common parts of blocks of flats?

[john01]

There are 4 seperate blocks of flats each containing 5 flats that are joined like terrace houses with one basement car park running below all 4. There are 4 seperate front doors, one to each block, would there need to be a seperate ( independant ) AFD panel in each block or only in one, connected to the others via repeater panels?

[TC9]

Hi All,

I saw the article in the Metro - all they appear to have succeeded in doing is worrying the wotsits out of the residents.

Does anyone have a reliable, confirmed statistic about how many people die each year from the inappropriate use of a fire extinguisher while fighting a fire?

I'd also be interested to see figures about the number of fires put out by members of the public before the brigade turned up. These should be available from insurance claims.

Can any one enlighten me?

thanks,

TC

[Chris Houston]

Essex FRS told me informally that 90% of fires are extinguished without any FRS involvement. I can't remember who said this or when, but anyone who thinks that people call 999 before pouring some water on a waste paper basket is kidding themselves. The public regularly extinguish little fires which never get reported.

[Paul2886]

Essex FRS told me informally that 90% of fires are extinguished without any FRS involvement. I can't remember who said this or when, but anyone who thinks that people call 999 before pouring some water on a waste paper basket is kidding themselves. The public regularly extinguish little fires which never get reported.

Then in a flat environment each resident, if they so wish, should supply their own extinguisher and keep it in an appropriate position within the flat. If you are a managing agent that supplies these tools then who is expected to grab one to fight a fire or are they just hung on the brackets, nothing said and we all keep their fingers crossed that no one gets injured. When an extinguisher is supplied the question must be asked why and for whom. Then surely as a managing agent there must be some sort of up front instruction and guidance. There are places that should be supplied with extinguishers and they would be were someone is employed on the premises that has to undergo statutory fire training. To just supply them and leave it as a free for all could be asking for problems

[Midland Retty]

Essex FRS told me informally that 90% of fires are extinguished without any FRS involvement. I can't remember who said this or when, but anyone who thinks that people call 999 before pouring some water on a waste paper basket is kidding themselves. The public regularly extinguish little fires which never get reported.

Very true. I think I remember one of my colleagues quoting the giovernment speil that 2 out of 3 fires never get reported to the Fire Service, which ties in with what you were told by Essex FRS Mr Houston

[jasper]

If the flats have wardens like the ones I have assessed lately, arnt the employers required to provide extinguishing medium for their own staff?
Also, in my opinion would a team of firefighters go in with hoses straight away? or do a recce?  as if they were checking if there was a fire then if it was small could use this (located on common area) to extinguish a relatively small fire without the need to go back out and then enter fully equipped to fight a then fully established fire with all the additional risks