Screwedfix!

[Wiz]

For anyone wondering just how some of those weird and wonderful fire alarm systems we've all seen get designed and installed, I would direct you to a link to a page on the Screwfix on-line shop.

It seems Screwfix will sell equipment suitable for BS5839 2002 Part 1 systems to anyone who wants it. But worse than this, their on-line shop includes information that could cause an unwary 'installer' to order and fit the wrong equipment.

If you click on the link below it will take you to a page in Screwfix's on-line shop that lists fire alarm equipement. If you scroll down the page you will see that their list includes a green emergency door release switch which is described as a 'Break Glass Call Point Fire Alarm Green' and if you click on this product you will find the advice for this products is;

Suitable for most conventional systems. Fit Call Points at all exits on ground floor and at each exit from each zone above ground floor. BS 5839.

Any comments?


http://www.screwfix.com/cats/A331851/Electrical/Fire-Smoke-Alarms/Fire-Alarms

[Chris Houston]

Wow.  If they don't know what the things are for, then what hope have their installers got!

It worrys me that people will think BS 5839 Part 1 is a product approval system, not a design and installation code.

[Chris Houston]

Even worse, I see the intal kit talks about it needing 2 wires, but there is no talk about the fire resistance of these wires, or how they must be intalled.  They say it meets with current standard, but do not explain how to install it per the standard.

[Galeon]

Yep , I'm not surprised , I believe the above firm is owned now by B & Q .

I have been in electrical wholesalers that have sold fire alarm 'kits' to builders.

There are more stringent rules for connecting a gas pipe in your own house .

I seem to remember Wickes removing all their technical 'here's how you do it' pamphlets , for obvious reasons.

Its going to get no better.

Cant find any gas extinguishing / sprinkler products , must be in the next edition ?

[Chris Houston]

We wouldn't allow a vet to do heart surgery, we wouldn't allow a plumber to work on electrics, cabin crew can't fly planes and taxi drivers don't drive HGVs.  But there is no law against any old Tom, Dick or Harry installing life safety fire alarm systems.  Weird.

[kurnal]

You dont give them full credit though Chris.

The instructions that come with the panel do advise the installer to read BS5839 part 1 1988 before starting, which they say should be available at the local library so thats all right then isnt it?

[Goodsparks]

Those red call points do look unsightly on some lighter coloured walls, maybe the green ones look better ? :-)

[Galeon]

Just a further thought on this matter, Screwfix was originally a trade company , when started , so you would have to fall into a category with them , therefore they would expect you to purchase equipment based experience and ability as such. So they wouldn't have expected a plumber to to into fire systems.
However where its all gone wrong , is when they are bought by a multinational , and therefore basically declassifies itself from the trade , and becomes a free for all.

[Galeon]

Those red call points do look unsightly on some lighter coloured walls, maybe the green ones look better ? :-)

But the added bonus is , you could also order 'no nails' or similar and you would need to worry about fixing equipment to the walls !

[Steven N]

beggars belief really Wiz sure to make all our lives easier, i dont think!

[Chris Houston]

You dont give them full credit though Chris.

The instructions that come with the panel do advise the installer to read BS5839 part 1 1988 before starting, which they say should be available at the local library so thats all right then isnt it?

So libraries keep not just copies of British Standards, but obsolete standards too?  I imagine all the part time sparkies will be queing up for them.

[Wiz]

Apart from the confusion of describing the use of a fire alarm manual call point to an emergency door release switch, there is also an error in this description, which Screwfix equally apply to the proper fire alarm manual call point:

Suitable for most conventional systems. Fit Call Points at all exits on ground floor and at each exit from each zone above ground floor. BS 5839.

Where does BS 5839 Part 1 2002 recommend that manual call points are installed at each exit from each zone above ground level?

My initial post was actually a test of all you fellow residents of this home for the slightly bewildered, and you've failed! Matron will now be force-feeding you all a dose of cod liver oil tonight!

[Graeme]

they also have a standard non addressable fulleon flashini beacon in a deep base as an intelligent(addressable) type.

I have pointed out the green "fire" MCP before somewhere

[Wiz]

.......I have pointed out the green "fire" MCP before somewhere

Sorry mate, I must have missed your earlier post. I was so stunned when I found it, I just had to share it with fellow residents!

[nearlythere]

Apart from the confusion of describing the use of a fire alarm manual call point to an emergency door release switch, there is also an error in this description, which Screwfix equally apply to the proper fire alarm manual call point:

Suitable for most conventional systems. Fit Call Points at all exits on ground floor and at each exit from each zone above ground floor. BS 5839.

Where does BS 5839 Part 1 2002 recommend that manual call points are installed at each exit from each zone above ground level?

My initial post was actually a test of all you fellow residents of this home for the slightly bewildered, and you've failed! Matron will now be force-feeding you all a dose of cod liver oil tonight!

I think they probably mean storey level rather than zone level. It is possible that the advise was written by a retd senior fire officer who, along with B&Q, assumed because of his/her previous position, must be an expert but in reality hadn't a clue.