Recording a FRA

[Tom Sutton]

I believe we should have a national standard on how a fire risk assessment should be recorded consequently I contacted ODPM and this was the response.(I was asking for another guide)
Eleven 'guides' will  be sufficient; All the 'guides' will have templates to assist you in recording your fire risk assessments; they will be uniform right across the guides to prevent any confusion. The new fire legislation will become law and non compliance will incur penalties or imprisonment.

[Ken Taylor]

Does this really mean that, at last, we will have official government guidance on the format and content of a fire risk assessment?

[Gary Howe]

Whats wrong with using PAS79?

If you want a standard format to record, here it is, and I imagine in a court of law it would stand up pretty well.

[Tom Sutton]

PAS79 has been discussed to some length on a previous topic but if the ODPM recommends that it should be the standard so be it. What I would like to see a recommended national standard so we are all sing from the same hymn sheet.

[jasper]

If PAS79 was the national standard would this not be the same as people having to use Pilkinton K Glass to achieve the required U Values in domestic premises

[Chris Houston]

If PAS79 was the national standard would this not be the same as people having to use Pilkinton K Glass to achieve the required U Values in domestic premises

Your post confuses me.  What do you mean?

[jasper]

Chris, if they make PAS79 'The' national standard it was not the government who wrote the standard, therefore the company selling the standard (BSI) would have sole wrights to the only approved standard in the country which has to be purchased for £100.
Like making Edwards butchers at the end of my street the only approved sausage sellers

[kurnal]

Sorry folks but I cant believe this thread.

At long last we have moved away from a prescriptive approach to Fire Safety- and now having taken this step forwards some of you want to step back to a prescriptive standard for risk assessment?

The Management Regulations and soon the Fire Safety Order set out the definitions for a suitable and sufficient risk assessment.
Can't we leave it at that?

[jasper]

Sorry folks but I cant believe this thread.

At long last we have moved away from a prescriptive approach to Fire Safety- and now having taken this step forwards some of you want to step back to a prescriptive standard for risk assessment?

The Management Regulations and soon the Fire Safety Order set out the definitions for a suitable and sufficient risk assessment.
Can't we leave it at that?

That would be nice!

But I would personally like to see something on the grounds of what should be included in a suitable and sufficient fra to stop any confusion / arguments (similar to what was shown in the fra course notes provided recently by Mr Todd)

[Chris Houston]

Like making Edwards butchers at the end of my street the only approved sausage sellers

If Edwards were internationally renowned for writing specifications regarding sausage manufacture, if they did not make sausages, if they had a royal charter for this purpose, if they have a published fair trading policy, a compliance committee and manager, if they undertook wide public consultation involving industry experts, if they were independently accredited, if they had laboratories, over 2000 employees, over 100 years experience, if the whole reason for their existence was to improve the quality of life of the public, if they did this and no one else did, then I would begin to consider your argument that the BSi is comparable to a butchers shop.

[Tom Sutton]

Sorry folks but I cant believe this thread.

At long last we have moved away from a prescriptive approach to Fire Safety- and now having taken this step forwards some of you want to step back to a prescriptive standard for risk assessment?

It is not a prescriptive approach to Fire Safety it is trying to achieve national recommendations how to record the results if a fire risk assessment.

[jasper]

I don’t think you understood my post Chris; the EU set this legislation not Bsi, therefore it should be the governments job to provide an approved specification. If PAS79 were used, this would give BSI a monopoly as being the only approved fra template.
Also, as they are not a profit making organisation, ploughing that much revenue generated back in to the company would be difficult.
Also, Edwards / bsi don’t just specify, they sell sausages / standards
p.s. I think the bsi do a great job (read their work every day

[Chris Houston]

I don’t think you understood my post Chris; the EU set this legislation not Bsi, therefore it should be the governments job to provide an approved specification. If PAS79 were used, this would give BSI a monopoly as being the only approved fra template.
Also, as they are not a profit making organisation, ploughing that much revenue generated back in to the company would be difficult.
Also, Edwards / bsi don’t just specify, they sell sausages / standards
p.s. I think the bsi do a great job (read their work every day

Your comparison us unfair.  BSi do not sell fire alarm systems, fire safety risk assessing, concrete or any other item that they write specifications for.  But you are right, I do not understand your post.

The HSE produce the only approved guidance on Health and Safety Matters
The Environment Agency advise us on flood prevention
The NICEIC approve electrical contractors
Only CORGI approved gas technicians can work on gas systems
Only UKAS approve third party inspection programs

Are all these organisations nasty monopolies? I don't think so, they are just the UK's experts in that type of thing.

[Ken Taylor]

Some 'official' guidance on the format and content of FRAs would be useful along the lines of HSE guidance in the realms of health and safety at work - which, whilst not being prescriptive, does prove useful in letting you know what is expected by the enforcing authority.

[jasper]

not even worth answering that 1