FireNet Community
FIRE SERVICE AND GENERAL FIRE SAFETY TOPICS => General Interest => Topic started by: maineroad on June 28, 2007, 07:24:34 PM
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As a group of FF we are more & more fed with the arrogance &out of touch attitude of the FBU.Members have been let down by officials who appear to be solely interested in thier future & not that of thier members we would like to join a public sector union or the TGWU as they have airport ff,any help ta.
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Fire Officers Association, (not specifically for officers) http://www.fireofficers.org.uk/
I have had more and more dealings with them in relation to a variety of issues from all roles.
Hope it is helpful.
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its a shame you feel that way about the FBU perhaps as or if you are a member you should take the path as a rep and make a difference? Its all well and good slating the union but its the only one worth being in and has any punch!
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its a shame you feel that way about the FBU perhaps as or if you are a member you should take the path as a rep and make a difference? Its all well and good slating the union but its the only one worth being in and has any punch!
That is open to debate, !!
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Swisstimmy
You are having a laugh - aren't you!
More and more FBU members are feeling that their interests are not being represented by their union.
My friends who are still in the job feel more and more that the union is hell bent on causing as much friction as possible between the management and the FBU members. this has got to the stage that most people can see the FBU for what they are - which historically is a union who justify their existence by creating disharmony!
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Swiss,we did not slate the union but when they were quizzed about fairness the actual reply was ,what do you expect you are a white male,I wrote to Matt Wrack with my problems but to no avail.Hopefuly the FBU work for allits members were you are sadly this was not the case for us ,this is not an easy or happy move to make but a sell out is a sell out !!!
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Its a common problem with unions. They get into politics and forget what they are for.
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As a member of the Airport fire service I would strongly advise against joining our union, I myself along with countless others are sick and tired of the union being out for itself, it has got to the stage where all the union wants, is to make itself larger and generate more money whilst at the same time ignore the members.
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I'll back Yeebsy up 100% on that one.
Our rep seems to occupy his time looking for things to cause trouble over and does it purely to satisfy his desire to cause friction and trouble. They would like nothing more than to lead the AFS out into another strike purely as a means of striking a blow to the employer, and not to the benefit of their members.
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We had 20-odd years of relative industrial calm in the fire service due entirely to the 1977 national strike and the benefits that ensued; pay formula, manning levels, shift patterns. We bacame complacent.
The pay formula slowly stopped working because it was based on the 'average pay of the upper quartile of male manual workers'. As the industrial base of the UK was decimated during the 80's, this formula became less and less productive and Maggie and her chums paid the bobbies more and more to keep the peace on ever-more beligerant picket lines. It was for this reason that the FBU geared up and demanded parity between bobbies and firefighters. Not an unreasonable one, and it would have ben achieved but for the FBU tactics of demanding imediate 40% increases (never going to happen) and 2-jags meddling.
This most recent dispute, in which the FBU got their butts wiped, has left FS managers with carte blanche to do basically whatever they want. Yes, the employers even fabricated a report to support their claim to be acting in the best interests of the service and the public. What they actually did was succeed in proving the old adage - Divide and Conquer! By rewarding some more than others they have fuelled resentment and fostered envy within the ranks of the FS. Imposition of R to R has done even more to fragment the structure as nobody knows now whether a Sub O or a Stn O is Watch Mgr A or B, or Crew Mgr is fit to take charge of a CFS leaflet drop. Then add IPDS to the mix along with competence and capability and that is how you get to throw the baby out with the bathwater.
All the good bits, the shift patterns, manning levels, etc, have been scarificed on the altar of efficiency, best value and toadying to the politico's to get the gong.
Will joining another organisation help stop this rot? Will joining the TGWU get you a voice that will be heard amongst the many within that organisation clamouring for attention? I think not. The FBU is your only avenue for change in the FS today and in the future. By leaving it, you weaken the union position when negotiations take place with employers. But more importantly, by not being active in the union, by not challenging and questioning everything they do in your name, you leave it open for those with other agenda's to hijack and use as their hobby-horse for political advancement.
Stick with the FBU and make the necessary changes from within. Collectively and individually, the power rests in your hands.
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There is only one union that represents Ffs effectively and that is, like it or not, the FBU. RFU/FOA are pure talking shops and they don't do that very well.
Don't listen to all the Media & government spun hype the FBU are the only fire service union to take seriously.
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So true Pete P and Pugh, how can you have a say if you don't belong to a recognised union and also if you don't try and do something about it!
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Please read my comments I have writtten to Matt Wrack,who did no think ff being threatened by principle officers, being hospitalised as a result of wild discipline cases (which basically collapsed) ff visited at home on the next day after being disscharged from hospital by officers with charge sheets in thier hands (FBU members) when asked about fairness for all FBU members the fbu replied ,what do you expect you are a white male.So brothers when the FBU sells you out as it did us after 20 years of active membership you to may question the FBU or Forget Bothering Us as it is now known quite simply they did not want to no.
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There is only one union that represents Ffs effectively and that is, like it or not, the FBU. RFU/FOA are pure talking shops and they don't do that very well.
Don't listen to all the Media & government spun hype the FBU are the only fire service union to take seriously.
Could'nt agree more. The RFU with their no strike policy is the equivilent of a sewing bee (you'll have to look that one up)
The employers pay them lip service, there was'nt much noise as Hertfordshire swung the axe and chopped Shenley and Bovingdon last year. Other retained stations will follow as the councils up and down the land realise there will be no resistance from the WRVS.
The FBU. like any union, will have it failings, but in comparisom to the strike breaking RFU and FOA, I know where my money will be going.
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I am by no means a big FBU trumpet blower but I think that it is better the devil you know. For years the FBU has been the only rep body that the employers have taken seriously, they only pay lip service to the others and they are desperate to get as may members as possible to leave the FBU to weaken it.
The FBU has been there for me on a couple of occasions and at other times I have had run ins and arguments with FBU officials. The reps may have their own political agendas sometimes but that is not always the case and remember that there is strength in unity.
Whatever you decide to do, I wish you luck with whoever you decide to use in order to represent you.
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Could not agree more about the RFU/FOA they are nothing but parasites ,the problem for us is that the FBU did not want to upset management & we ended up getting decent advice from solicitors we paid for ,they seem to enjoy tea with the principal officers more than with thier members!!!
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Could not agree more about the RFU/FOA they are nothing but parasites ,the problem for us is that the FBU did not want to upset management & we ended up getting decent advice from solicitors we paid for ,they seem to enjoy tea with the principal officers more than with thier members!!!
I've no idea what Brigade your a member of, but I can assure you that scenario does'nt happen in Region 10.
Yes. there are meetings, but none of our reps hob nob with the authority, quite the opposite thay stand firm, and deliver our views. (Brian Coleman, take note)
Shift changes, Beds, CFS work, Push bikes (yes push bikes) are all currently being discussed.
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Thats why your region has not been ripped up yet & has rtd ff doing w/t ff jobs while they are out doing cfs in vans ,its all TRUE
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Thats why your region has not been ripped up yet & has rtd ff doing w/t ff jobs while they are out doing cfs in vans ,its all TRUE
I can't see London ever going down the retained route. A house within 5 mins of say Barnet or Mill Hill Fire Stations would set you back around £350K. I can't see many people being interested, they're more likely to be either 76 or work in the city. :)
The push for twelve hour shifts would however allow them to have people who only want to work days covering these stations with no night cover, instead a pump from a two appliance station would be sent in at night.
But then the LFEPA know they will have a strike on their hands when they try to implement this strategy, which is why two years after the initial suggestion nothing has happened.
Unlike Merseyside which managed to crew about 15 machines with senior officers and scabs, the LFEPA would struggle to cover London. The majority of officers up to the rank of D.O have already told senior management and the authority that it's a stupid idea. Almost as stupid as giving Brian Coleman his driving license back when his ban is up, but perhaps not quite as stupid as £1200 silly chairs which give you back pain.
;)
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I have to say London that you’re lucky that staff stick together. In other brigades someone will always come in for overtime, but not on nights because of the chairs. My own experience is that the fbu are only interested in anybody who rides on a red truck not training staff or fire safety officers. But still a member.
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I have to say London that you’re lucky that staff stick together. In other brigades someone will always come in for overtime, but not on nights because of the chairs. My own experience is that the fbu are only interested in anybody who rides on a red truck not training staff or fire safety officers. But still a member.
London's far from perfect Dave. We too have people (with the Unions blessing) who do pre-arranged overtime, personally I think its a dodgy road to go down as they can manage on around 100 FF's short of the required establishment, instead relying on Pre-arranged to cover the shortfall in the summer months when annual leave is most commonly taken.
However, I would like to believe No one would come in to work during a strike for whatever rate the authority offered. There will always be a few, but they really are a tiny percentage consisting of non union FF's.