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FIRE SAFETY => Fire Risk Assessments => Topic started by: nearlythere on December 17, 2011, 11:36:02 AM

Title: NI HTM 86 Pt2
Post by: nearlythere on December 17, 2011, 11:36:02 AM
I have had a query regarding competency for carrying out a Fire Risk Assessment. The registration body has told a small two dentist practice that that the level of competency for the Assessor should be as per NI HTM 86 Pt2
It says that the guide is for use by competence persons but that risk assessments should be carried out by qualified and experienced persons.
That to me means that the average ex fire safety bod is not able to do fire risk assessments and any that have been done are not valid.
It goes on the say that Qualification/experience means that a science, engineering or construction based education and experience of fire safety is essential  and that a science, engineering or construction degree with extensive experience of
healthcare fire safety is desirable.
How many of us now are able to do fire risk assessments of dental practices in NI?
I have carried out FRAs for sports grounds with an occupancy factor of many thousands, multi storey hotels, residential and nursing homes, large shops and office blocks, it goes on. all of which I have had audited by the F&R Service or Local Authority without question but I can't do a any dental practices.

Use by competent persons
2.4 NIHTM 86 should be used by competent persons employed as:
• Property/Estates/Building/Engineering officers, Facilities Management
and Health/Fire Safety staff in a healthcare facility;  
• Architectural, Building and Engineering consultants;
http://• Building control officers;
• Fire safety consultants;
• Officers of the Fire and Rescue Service.

It is essential that fire risk assessments are carried out by suitably qualified and
experienced personnel.  In assessing the competency of the fire risk assessor,
professional qualifications and experience on projects of similar complexity
should be taken into account.
It should be noted that the level of skills and experience necessary for
competent fire risk assessors may vary according to the complexity of the
building, the materials and processes used and the type of occupants in it.
Table 1 provides guidance on the level of qualification and experience that may
be considered necessary to establish an appropriate degree of competency.

 
Title: Re: NI HTM 86 Pt2
Post by: Midland Retty on December 19, 2011, 12:11:49 PM
Hi NT

I don't deal with NI regs but the way I read the excerpt from the HTM is as follows. It talks about having an "education" in science, engineering and construction, which is ambiguous.

It states that edcuation to degree level is desirable (but not essential) So what level of education are they looking for?

Does education include occupational training? I suspect it would.

So in the case of an ex fire officer (by that I mean ex fire safety officer) would the "education" they had from in-house training, and the Fire Service College be applicable? Dependent on their rank (sorry role) they would have had science, engineering and construction input of some description during their career, certainly during fire safety courses. Some of the input may have been basic, or very technical in nature.

Then you also have things like professional membership of the IFE and the like. Im sure that would count towards demonstrating "education" in those fields.

Sorry NT not sure it answers your question really, the ambiguity is the term "education".

 
Title: Re: NI HTM 86 Pt2
Post by: Rex on December 19, 2011, 12:22:13 PM
NT
Just for information purposes HTM86 Pt 2 has been replaced with HTM 05-03 Part K [Fire Risk Assessments] but unfortunately does not answer your question, but gives further information on the subject.
Regards
Rex. 
Title: Re: NI HTM 86 Pt2
Post by: nearlythere on December 19, 2011, 01:08:18 PM
NT
Just for information purposes HTM86 Pt 2 has been replaced with HTM 05-03 Part K [Fire Risk Assessments] but unfortunately does not answer your question, but gives further information on the subject.
Regards
Rex. 
Thanks Rex. HTM86 Pt2 is Northern Ireland's guidance on FRAs. Will try and post Doc.
Title: Re: NI HTM 86 Pt2
Post by: nearlythere on December 19, 2011, 01:11:57 PM
NT
Just for information purposes HTM86 Pt 2 has been replaced with HTM 05-03 Part K [Fire Risk Assessments] but unfortunately does not answer your question, but gives further information on the subject.
Regards
Rex. 
Thanks Rex. HTM86 Pt2 is Northern Ireland's guidance on FRAs. Will try and post Doc.
I'm afraid when it comes to posting links this website has me beat.

Kurnal.  Can I email to you for posting?
Title: Re: NI HTM 86 Pt2
Post by: kurnal on December 19, 2011, 09:35:32 PM
NT yes you can but whilst on firenet open another tab in your browser, visit the website you are looking for, right click on the address anc copy the link, then switch back to the firenet tab and right click within your posting to paste the link. Simples?
Title: Re: NI HTM 86 Pt2
Post by: nearlythere on December 19, 2011, 09:38:44 PM
NT yes you can but whilst on firenet open another tab in your browser, visit the website you are looking for, right click on the address anc copy the link, then switch back to the firenet tab and right click within your posting to paste the link. Simples?
I have the guide in my documents folder.
Title: Re: NI HTM 86 Pt2
Post by: kurnal on December 19, 2011, 09:42:23 PM
I think you have to upload your document to a webside such as photobucket and then link to that. I keep trying to learn myself but end up getting distracted and start looking at the pictures and dreaming again.
Title: Re: NI HTM 86 Pt2
Post by: nearlythere on December 20, 2011, 06:33:16 AM
Far too difficult for me doing that. Much easier to type the whole document text into the post. Will investigate another way unless there is some wizz kid there able to do it for me.
Title: Re: NI HTM 86 Pt2
Post by: nearlythere on December 20, 2011, 07:43:53 AM
I have downloaded it to Skydrive and created a link but I just cannot post the link.