FireNet Community
FIRE SERVICE AND GENERAL FIRE SAFETY TOPICS => Technical Advice => Topic started by: Ian Randall on September 05, 2005, 05:41:27 PM
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Fire-fighting Foams are classified in 2 ways.
Anyone have any ideas ?
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Whats this Ian? a quiz?
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is the answer mechanical and chemical (i was a quiz team member, even though i didnt really know stuff, i could read and sometimes remember. i was the proby and the sub though it would make him look good!) - oops, nearly forgot, 'answer complete sir!'
those were the years!!
dave bev
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Does anyone actually use chemical foam anymore though!
(Other than for playing the toilet trap trick with the 2 gallon portable refill packs!)
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How's about mechanical and aspirated?
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It's no quiz, i,m doing my Euro FP Dip.
When i find out i will let you all know
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ian, seriously, im sure it is mechanical and chemical!
dave bev
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Mr P mechanical is aspirated!
Mechanical is foam produced by a mechanical means, i.e. mixing a solution, forceably, with a gas - aspiration.
Chemical is foam produced by chemical reaction producing bubbles.
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do i win the holiday of a weekend for two in moreton in marsh ?
dave bev
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I thought it was mechanical and chemical.
According to 'the FM/ship Manual' on Fire Equipment (Book 3) it is:
Foams used for fire fighting are classified in two ways.
1. According to their expansion
i.e. LX, MX and HX
2. according to their principal constituents
i.e. Protein
Fluro P
Fluro Chem etc etc etc
Tough this Dip course aint it
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dont believe everything you read in manuals of firemanship - i think you may find some have been superceded - a bit like man united in the champions league - super seeds!!
dave bev
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Book 3 is rather out of date - although I understand the Foam section has been reissued as part of the new fire service manuals.
The extinguisher bit in the pump is very obsolete & as for stirrup pumps.....
I always understood that there were two types of making foam - chemical by the reaction of seperate powdered chemicals (bicarb/saponin with aluminium sulphate) & concentrate where the foaming agent is one concentrated solution to be inducted into water for deliver as aspirated or non aspirated finished foam.
The concentrate form has been called various names such as mechanical foam, "air" foam, etc.
Yes you have varying ways of applying foam - N-A, LX, MX & HX and via branch, monitor, pourer, sprinkler, base injection.
Plus there are now many types of concentrate, the traditional P, FP, AFFF & FFFP with their -AR counterparts have a myriad of new compounds and application methods an example is compressed air foam.
A very good starter reference to Foam is the Angus Foam Handbook if you can borrow a copy. I don't know if they still produce it, but even if not they still produce a lot of useful reference some linked via their WWW
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AB -- yep Book 3 has been supereceded. Chemical foam extinguishers are no longer manufactured and so the original question is purely a scientific one, certainly no practical fire extinguishing relevance any longer.
The pump section is very obsolete is it? Well the bits about reciprocating primers and the like may seem so but there still fire fighting vehicles around with them, maybe not in LA FRS use. As for stirrup pumps I feel it is you who is obsolete (or maybe too far advanced) after there are two main means of extinguishing a chimney fire (we still have them 'in the sticks' - consist of such quaint things as hearths, flues, fireplaces, wood/coal and flamey stuff in the room - make heat ). 1 From the pot (roofs have them in places where they have those fireplace thingummybobs) using a hosereel or 2 From the hearth (in your cozy urban abode probably that funny thing in the lounge that has the flowers/electric pretend fire or 'living' flame gas gizmo) using a STIRRUP pump and chimney nozzle/rods and hose. So very much still in use. Some people have gone away from them and have hosereel fittings on the chimney nozzle/hose but he bucket and stirrup pump are easier to carry into the house still.
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I did wonder if the stirup pump & chimney rods were retained for chimney fires, as that was one use they still seemed very relevant for. I have my answer!
!
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Sorry for the sarcasm Anthony!
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fireftrm - appologies for error as you have pointed out above. Someone else now has email with the middle bit from what has left a short sentance. I hate that when you are typing, screen pop ups take over. It should have read 'mechanical - non aspirated and aspirated' then on to other stuff, but operator and key board errors...
Any way, thread has progressed with points. Must remember to check better prior to posting.
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Even worse - I have found myself typing a relpy to an online message when a new message popped up (from a work colleague) and that I had therefore written to them instead (the new window having become active by default) - embarrasing as the previous message was for my partner - you may guess the rest!