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FIRE SERVICE AND GENERAL FIRE SAFETY TOPICS => Service Training OR Recruitment => Topic started by: Billy on November 15, 2005, 06:35:38 PM
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I am curious to know the level of Incident Management training that Officers receive throughout the UK FRS.
Is Incident Management training compulsory before you take charge of an appliance?
Do all Officers receive regular training on the subject?
Any information or comments would be gratefully received.
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I've done some work with COMAH listed sites with industry Billy.
One of the biggest IM training companies is Link Associates based in Leeds if you want any further info email me.
Cheers
Paul
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Billy
Do you mean incident management in terms of the incident command and the ICS? If os it SHOULD be included in the devlopment of anyone who is to be allowed to take charge of an appliance alone. It may well be that this is on-going, with supervision, in the first instnace but completed before they go solo. Here it is a short course for those likely to act-up on occasions and is full development for those who are temporary, or on CM development programmes. For acting up the course gives enough understnading to allow the individual to hold the incident until the arrival of a competent supervisor, those on development should always have a supervisor/mentor with them to allow them to make decisions under supervision
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Doesn't happen in Cheshire Firey?
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Fireftrm
Yes, I am talking about Incident Management and ICS and I totally agree with the concept you mention, but is there anywhere that this is written as national guidance?
Secondly, you mention a competent supervisor, but do they have qualifications or passed any assessments that make them competent, and is their competency measured regularly?
Psmith
Thanks, E-mail is on its way.
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Yes, the guidance is the form of the role maps and NOS. The relevant unit being WM7 - that people should recive development is clear through IPDs - examples:
All development is intended to be personal and role specific and will be identified through the Personal Development Review Process. Everyone has responsibility to look after their own CPD and at every level in the FRS skills like leadership and communication are important and should be developed within the workplace
http://www.ipds.co.uk/public/site/newsdocs57/helix%20explained.pdf shows the route to the next level.
Assessment of competence will be by experienced supervisors, if the NVQ process is being applied then they must be qualified. Everyone's competence is now constnatly monitored (or should be) as IPDs requires that maintenance of skills be adopted and recorded
I suggest that FRAs that are not using these natioanl policies and guidlines should be giving good reasons why not.
Before you can act-up or be temporary you need to satisy this (s20 Pay of Grey Book):
20. It is necessary for an employee who acts up or is temporarily promoted to have:
(1) demonstrated competence in his or her current role;
(2) demonstrated the potential to develop beyond his or her current role; and
(3) successfully completed the relevant assessment process for the higher role
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I am familiar with the role maps and the relevant standards but have all FRS now fully implemented IPDS, and if so, what training is given on Incident Management?
How does personnel satisfy WM7 which relates to leading and controlling personnel to manage operational incidents if they are at a quiet station, or in CFS?
I believe that the reduction in the amount of fires we attend should be countered by a proportionate increase in incident management training to ensure skill levels are maintained and was wondering if other FRS are finding any variations in the knowledge and experience levels of their Officers nowadays than that in the past?
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In response to your question Billy, No not all FRS have implemented IPDS. There are very few indeed, and even some that have said they have implememnted IPDS in full have really only done it in name only.
With reference to WM 7. A person working in Community Safety would not have to work towards WM 7 as they cannot acheiev it within their function. The same is for a WM in cntrol, they work to WM 8.
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Rips
What is your procedure then for personnel coming out of CFS and going in charge of appliances?
Do they receive training on Incident Management?
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When an individual is going to move from CS to Operational Response (whether it be a sideways move or promotion) they will have to complete a role related assessment (RRA) first. They would then have to work towards the units within their new function.
It might be the case the individual needs training/refreshing on Incident management.
Hope that makes sense.
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you have one day to respond to
http://www.odpm.gov.uk/index.asp?id=1125650
CONSULTATION ON RECRUITMENT AND PROGRESSION OF FIRE AND RESCUE SERVICE STAFF
closing date 2nd december
you dont have to answer all the questions, you can just make comment on some of the suggestions - posters to this topic should have contributed, you dont have to respnd bvia a brigade, individuals can resond if they wish, you raise genuine and valid concerns - so put them into the consultation process
dave bev
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The Fire Service College at Moreton now do a fantastic course to prepare future Crew Managers and current serving Crew Managers for incident management. The course covers ICS, all relevant legislation, managing incidents and you are scored against WM7 elements throughout the course. The course is nearly all operational and involves incidents from the easiest 1 pump incident to a large 4 pump incident.
I can recommend the IMF course to anyone, it boosts your confidence, your skills and your incident knowledge. By the way IMF is Incident Management Foundation.
Regards
Kaiser Kev
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Kaiser
Glad you got a lot out of the course as it sounds as if it is worthwhile- but what is in place back in your own FRS?
Do you receive ongoing training?
How long would it take to train all similar ranks/roles within your FRS?
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My own FRS is in the process of introducing a new course in the near future to assist CM's. With regards to ongoing training after that, not a lot happens at the moment.
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In Kent we run ICS Level 1, 2 , 3 and 4 ( Bronze, Silver and Gold). All CM / WM will have attended a two dayLevel 1 course before riding in charge, all SM will have attendined a three day level 2 and all AM a Level 3. GM BM a three day level 4. We use the Vector Command system to run the scenarios which are recoreded for evidence.
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Just out of interest, how do your various brigades deliver incident command training that is role specific. For instance, under IPDS module 008 Incident Command 1 applies to crew and watch managers, as does WM 7 under the NOS standards.
However, we expect a different level of performance from a watch manager when dealing with operational incidents, examplified by the fact that certain calls will attract the attendance of a watch manager, indicating it is beyond the expected level of skill and responsibility that a crew manager possesses.
Has anyone experienced a system where these different levels are quantified and applied to IC training for the different roles?
Cheers
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No basically, it tends to be a bit ad hoc. It's a shame that it's not possible for all OIC's to attend the IMF course at Moreton. It is excellent and highlights great deficiencies in "on the job" training.
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In the North East Region there is a CM managaing incidents course (3 weeks) and then a WM MI (3 days - covering additional responsibilities that come with multi-appliance incidents). SMMI is presently being looked at as regional course to replace the FSC SMMI.