Domiciliary Care Workers RA

[Paul2886]

A query for you. Do domicillary workers that go into private houses providing care need to have a fire risk assessment done on each home, as its a place of work whilst they are there. Just been ask to provide this service by an agency

[kurnal]

No- they are  a  private dwelling and not subject to the Fire Safety Order.
The employer needs robust policies and  a safe system of work however under the HASAWA and needs to train their domiciliary staff - the safe person concept. Fire safety aspects are no different than other H&S issues, for example for the new smoking legislation, the employer should  reach agreement with client that they will not smoke whilst employees are present. They cant enforce it but if client smokes employer withdraws service. Fire safety matters are dealt with in a similar vein. client has to agree not to juggle petrol whilst employee presenty- or if they do employee is taught to leave. Lone working issues are paramoount.

[PhilB]

No- they are  a  private dwelling and not subject to the Fire Safety Order.

They are 'Domestic premises' and not subject to the Order, a subtle but important difference.

A single private dwelling may be subject to certain parts of the Order if it does not consist of, or is not comprised in a house..anorak off!

So FSO order does not require a risk assessment but as Kurnal correctly points out HASAW Act does...safe person concept.

[nearlythere]

No- they are  a  private dwelling and not subject to the Fire Safety Order.
The employer needs robust policies and  a safe system of work however under the HASAWA and needs to train their domiciliary staff - the safe person concept. Fire safety aspects are no different than other H&S issues, for example for the new smoking legislation, the employer should  reach agreement with client that they will not smoke whilst employees are present. They cant enforce it but if client smokes employer withdraws service. Fire safety matters are dealt with in a similar vein. client has to agree not to juggle petrol whilst employee presenty- or if they do employee is taught to leave. Lone working issues are paramoount.

Not questioning your expertise Kurnal but is the dwelling not a place of work for the carer during the time he/she is in the premises? The carer does not use the premises as a dwelling.

[PhilB]

Not questioning your expertise Kurnal but is the dwelling not a place of work for the carer during the time he/she is in the premises? The carer does not use the premises as a dwelling.

Yes the dwelling is a place of work and therefore under the HASAW Act the employer is required to risk assess the situation but not necessarily the premises. i.e. the safe person concept. Just as the FRS do not risk asssess every building before it has a fire, safe person concept backed up by dynamic risk assessment.

The place of work in this case is in a domestic premises so the Fire Safety Order does not apply. This subject was clearly explained in FPA circular 28 which gave guidance on the WP Regs. Unfortunately similar detailed guidance has not yet been published but the situation is exactly the same.

If domestic premises were covered by the order the milkman, postman, midwife, gas fitter, chimney sweep, . etc. etc. would have to carry out a risk assessment of most of the planet!!!!

TCH TCH questioning Kurnal indeed!

[wee brian]

Kurnal and PhilB are spot on with this.

[kurnal]

TCH TCH questioning Kurnal indeed!

Much as I appreciate your sentiment Phil (even if your tongue is pushing a hole in the side of your face) I very much welcome people questioning some of the  cobblers I sometimes post on here. And it gives me a perfect  excuse to get involved in pedantic and irrelevant detail- as if I need one.

[nearlythere]

TCH TCH questioning Kurnal indeed!

Much as I appreciate your sentiment Phil (even if your tongue is pushing a hole in the side of your face) I very much welcome people questioning some of the  cobblers I sometimes post on here. And it gives me a perfect  excuse to get involved in pedantic and irrelevant detail- as if I need one.

Thanks for your professional approach to this and other matters K. We can only but broaded our understanding of the black art by challenging the opinions of others.
When did opinion change that the earth is round and you can't fall off the edge of it?