Emergency access from maisonettes

[JC100]

Hi

Just after your opinions on this. I recieved a call this morning about a maisonette. The building in question is 3 storeys, G, 1, 2, 3 with maisonettes taking up 2 floors. There are 38 maisonettes in total.
The problem is this...one resident has called in asking for a yale lock to be replaced on what she calls her emergency escape door from her bedroom. This door gives her access to another door which in turn leads her in to her neighbours flat.
I haven't seen the property yet so have no idea on compartmentation in the corridors leading to the flats or what exits are available to them.  Has anyone ever heard of this before and from this got any ideas? Could we possibly brick up these doors and install fire doors in the flat with some hard wired smoke detection?

[afterburner]

Sounds like the sort of arrangement in hotels to allow individual bedrooms to interconnect to form a suite of rooms. But that is for a group of people who (presumably) agree to occupy the suite. When required as individual rooms the interconnecting double doors are locked and passage denied. I've never heard of this concept being used as a fire exit route (although I've no doubt others may well have run across the idea).
Resident wants her yale lock replaced, which suggests these doors are already lockable. How is this overcome for fire exit purposes? Your concerns for separation and compartmentation naturally follow on.

[JC100]

Apparently a previous flat owner installed the lock, this is the lock that is now broken and the repair team for the organisation i work for are refusing to fit the lock as they think it is for fire exit and must be openable without a key.

IF these doors were for fire exit purposes, there would be no way of knowing if a tennant blocked over the door with a wardrobe or even padlocked it to give them added security. Surely this would cause greater problems than if not there at all.

[Midland Retty]

Hi

Just after your opinions on this. I recieved a call this morning about a maisonette. The building in question is 3 storeys, G, 1, 2, 3 with maisonettes taking up 2 floors. There are 38 maisonettes in total.
The problem is this...one resident has called in asking for a yale lock to be replaced on what she calls her emergency escape door from her bedroom. This door gives her access to another door which in turn leads her in to her neighbours flat.
I haven't seen the property yet so have no idea on compartmentation in the corridors leading to the flats or what exits are available to them.  Has anyone ever heard of this before and from this got any ideas? Could we possibly brick up these doors and install fire doors in the flat with some hard wired smoke detection?

I have come across this before

In the "olden days" this layout was permitted, and as you point out residents would evacuate into a neighbouring flat. Sometimes this was done using interconnectiong balconies too.

 In practice however you tend to find that the adjacent flat would lock the access doors for privacy reasons and the evacueee would be left stranded with no where to go.

As you suggest therefore Id look at recommending the installation of AFD coupled with appropriate levels of FR (dont forget if the resident cant hit her front door within 9 meteres you may have to look at FR within the flat to form a protected route).

[JC100]

Thanks for your replies. The building was built in 1975 so isn't that old.

[Tom Sutton]

Thanks for your replies. The building was built in 1975 so isn't that old.

Thank you for that comment smokescreen but as MR has stated this was acceptable in the seventies including balconies and knock out panels. I hasten to add these were the policies of Building Control and fire brigades were not involved except when they had to pull the occupants out of windows at 2 O’clock in the morning.

[jokar]

I think ou will find that these were built to a standard called CP 3 and therefore are allowable.  Obvious problems have already been stated, ale locks are an acceptable lock on fire exoits in residential accommodation.

[kurnal]

I wonder if under the RRO the interconnecting balconies between flats would be deemed to be common areas or considered part of the domestic property?

And how the RRO would view pass doors between flats? (though actually if I recall  pass doors between flats were  not mentioned in CP3- the pass doors were intended to be between interlinking bedrooms in the same flat) If these were provided the door itself could also be deemed to be a common area? Legally I reckon the Fire service may theoretically be able to enforce but would be a legal  and logistical nightmare (thinking aloud?)(hastens to add in England and Wales). And of course doors between flats would  also breach the compartmentation.

These arrangements were a querk of CP3 Chapter 4 part 1 1971. But there were many blocks built well before then that had them too.