EN54 part 2 & 4 instead of BS.

[Benzerari]

A couple of new Gent Vigilon panels have just been fitted, in one of our customer's sites; the panels are marked up 'designed to EN54 part 2 & 4 instead of either BS or both BS EN54... like usual...

The panels are manufactured in UK! It seems there is no need any more to mention BS, so EN54 part 2 and 4 means both! Is that correct? Or am I misinterpreting?

[Allen Higginson]

A couple of new Gent Vigilon panels have just been fitted, in one of our customer's sites; the panels are marked up 'designed to EN54 part 2 & 4 instead of either BS or both BS EN54... like usual...

The panels are manufactured in UK! It seems there is no need any more to mention BS, so EN54 part 2 and 4 means both! Is that correct? Or am I misinterpreting?

Panels manufactured in the UK are not specifically now for the UK market and (as in the case of the Advanced and Minerva panels) do not come with a zonal LED board.This of course is fine if the system is designed to en54 but not to BS5839.I have pulled comm certs that are plastered in BS5839 references but have used such panels.

[Graeme]

yep and only to save approx £30

C-tec done a BS - EN difference a while ago and they sold EN panels with all the BS features and more for less...


there was also some points like BS requires audible and visual indication of any disablements- EN does not require either..

[Allen Higginson]

yep and only to save approx £30

C-tec done a BS - EN difference a while ago and they sold EN panels with all the BS features and more for less...


there was also some points like BS requires audible and visual indication of any disablements- EN does not require either..

UK Morley gives the option of BS or EN in the set up menu.

[patrickhamblin]

The BSI catalogue indicates that BS5839-4:1988 - Fire detection and alarm systems for buildings - specification for control and indicating equipment - has been withdrawn and replaced by BS EN 54-2:1998 and BS EN 54-4:1998. I am not clear why BS 5839-4 is still being used at all.

[Allen Higginson]

The BSI catalogue indicates that BS5839-4:1988 - Fire detection and alarm systems for buildings - specification for control and indicating equipment - has been withdrawn and replaced by BS EN 54-2:1998 and BS EN 54-4:1998. I am not clear why BS 5839-4 is still being used at all.

Under 2002+A2:2008 there is still mention of zonal LED's and,as Graeme has indicated,why not fit for the cost of an extra £30?

[Wiz]

I understood the concept of EN standards was that there would be one standard throughout Europe. I think they called it harmonisation.

On that basis, one wonders why BS still has any role to play. This would be equally true of any other EU member's former national standards.

Is it a case of EU member's national standards organisations not willing to give up their roles/control so they continue to issue their own recommendations and ensure that there is always 'differences' in them? Do they'petition' others to continue to recognise their own standard? Are we paying twice for a similar service?

I don't know the answer. I don't understand what is going on either!

[Benzerari]

What about panels manufactured in EU, would they be acceptable to be used in UK?

An old friend of mine who is a teacher in one of the universities in Germany (I used to consult him in couple of issues), he said to me one day, when alarm goes in any building (in Germany), it shows it on panel with red LED and a bleep instead of loud alarm..., and only when fire fighters turn up and investigate, they decide either to evacuate the building or reset the system, the evacuation is just by pressing the Evac. button...etc

How would this kind of panels be acceptable in UK?

[Wiz]

A panel manufactured anywhere to EN54 should be able to be used in the UK (if zone indicator issue etc taken in to account if BS recommendations must be met)

It is possible that the German panel is just programmed to operate the way described, but as a panel it still meets the requirements of EN54.

Conversely, It would certainly be possible to programme a typical EN54 addressable panel currently being used in a BS5839 system to operate in exactly the same way as the german panel you mention.

[Benzerari]

A panel manufactured anywhere to EN54 should be able to be used in the UK (if zone indicator issue etc taken in to account if BS recommendations must be met)

It is possible that the German panel is just programmed to operate the way described, but as a panel it still meets the requirements of EN54.

Conversely, It would certainly be possible to programme a typical EN54 addressable panel currently being used in a BS5839 system to operate in exactly the same way as the german panel you mention.

Certainly, they should then be at least marked up BS EN54 Pt 2 & 4

[Wiz]

A panel manufactured anywhere to EN54 should be able to be used in the UK (if zone indicator issue etc taken in to account if BS recommendations must be met)

It is possible that the German panel is just programmed to operate the way described, but as a panel it still meets the requirements of EN54.

Conversely, It would certainly be possible to programme a typical EN54 addressable panel currently being used in a BS5839 system to operate in exactly the same way as the german panel you mention.

Certainly, they should then be at least marked up BS EN54 Pt 2 & 4

Certainly, they should then use comic sans typeface with a minimum colour contrast of 5:1 to background

[Benzerari]

The BSI catalogue indicates that BS5839-4:1988 - Fire detection and alarm systems for buildings - specification for control and indicating equipment - has been withdrawn and replaced by BS EN 54-2:1998 and BS EN 54-4:1998. I am not clear why BS 5839-4 is still being used at all.

If so, why new panels of giant companies are not mentioning BS EN54 part 2 & 4 on their new panels some of them shows just BS5839 part 2 & 4 and others EN54 part 2 & 4?

What are our standards then? Since it still some differences between the two!