Locks and responsibility (hope this is in the right section)

[al69]

Hi first post here, im a locksmith and seeing quite a lot of debate about locks and fire regs etc on locksmith forums.Two issues have cropped up with much confusion as to what is correct etc so hopefully you could help.

1.
If a locksmith is asked by a landlord to fit for example a 5 lever british standard insurance approved lock on a flat door to keep insurers happy but thus not complying with multiple occupancy rules of keyless exit.

Who would be liable or responsible if the worst happened and a fire etc occurred with injury or loss of life ?
Is it the landlord who is responsible,the locksmith or even both ?

2.
A locksmith is asked to do some work on an office block and notices that all of the doors have 5 lever locks fitted and no keyless exit.He advises the office owner it may need the lot changing to keyless exit so wont proceed with the work until its clarified with a fire officer. Is this the correct approach or do you just do as the owner asks ignoring the existing hardware thats fitted ?

Could the locksmith then be liable in the event of the worst happening ?


The problems facing the locksmith market is that everyone has jumped on the band wagon and work is getting scarcer so many dont want to risk losing a job and take the money regardless.Personally i would rather wallk away and sleep at night but the debates rage on with what seems a very grey area of the regs from our point of view.

Your views and opinions are most welcome and if you can point to the exact regs on any specific points that would be most helpful.

Many thanks Al

[kurnal]

Generally, flats are  single Private dwellings occupied by a single household and in the circumstances the fire safety order does not apply. The Fire Safety Order 2005 does not apply to domestic properties. Generally in a single private dwelling it is accepted that the householder can be trusted to know where the key is. It only gets difficult where the dwelling is occupied by several different households or individuals. Obviously those doors in the common areas used by more than one household must offer keyless exit.

Sorry if I am stating the obvious but it may be relevant to point out that for other buildings keyless exit is only required when a building is occupied.  It is ok for a building to be fully secured and locked down outside occupied hours.  So if you notice in the office block that the doors are locked whilst the building is occupied I guess you are morally obliged to point this out and if you do so you could not found wanting. If you are asked to fit a lock in such circumstances and you wanted to make sure that your back was covered you could point out on the order or delivery note that the responsible person should ensure that robust arrangements are in place to unlock the doors and remove the keys at the start of business. You will understand of course there can be no guarantees, in the event of a fire tragedy the investigation would be thorough and no one can predict how the courts might apportion blame. Hindsight is always a wonderful thing.

[Clevelandfire 3]

In  buildings of multiple occupation which encompasses house in multiple occupation keyless egress is a must. In purpose built flats exit from an individual flat can be by means of a key the rationale being that the householder will have the keys readily available. Advise you client in writing of the need for keyless entry in buildings of multi occupancy and you will be covered. Dont do it verbally.

Careful about claims that the regulatory reform order doesn't apply to single domestic dwellings. Firstly it only applies in england and wales and secondly it may apply to individual flats since there is no case law to suggest it doesn't in blocks of flats IF the flat is let to a tennant rather than an owner occupier.

Anyone else reading this had better not refer to the case about student accomodation, anyone with an ounce of common sense will recognise that case doesnt apply to blocks flats 

[Mike Buckley]

"Advise you client in writing of the need for keyless entry in buildings of multi occupancy and you will be covered."

Surely you mean keyless exit, a thumb latch on the eixt would satisfy the need for a keyless exit but still need a key to access the place.