Author Topic: Message from Mr.P and a query about means of escape for disabled people  (Read 2688 times)

Offline kurnal

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Received this message from Mr.P

I cannot post to the forum any longer because of Employers software protocols but, do still read and keep up with the threads.
can you help with this question please?
 
Evacuation times from buildings - for people with dis-abilities, particularly double/treble amputees in wheelchairs...
 
I have gone through the usual references and everything from refuges to stay put policies and assisted rescues is covered but not times. Should we continue using the old ABC class of building times of 2, 2 1/2, 3 minutes etc?
 
A particular scenario - wheelchair users taking part in sports events in large purpose built sports hall, 5 exits of 3UEW.
 
Obviously the time of evac size of exits etc. and floor space gives total persons calc but, any knowledge experience and comments would be good.
 
I'd get a large round in if only I could get back in the t'internet bar for dislodged members!!!
Mr P
You would be more than welcome- indeed post me a wad and I will get the round in for you! You can log in on a smart phone or public internet access point
« Last Edit: February 03, 2012, 08:24:23 AM by kurnal »

Offline kurnal

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Re: Message from Mr.P and a query about means of escape for disabled people
« Reply #1 on: February 02, 2012, 07:22:02 PM »
In response to Mr. Ps question I would suggest that in the situation you describe the ASET will be massive due to a large high space and few combustibles. I would do a fag packet calculation to demonstrate it. In other situations I would suggest that the person should be out of a storey exit or fire compartment into a protected refuge within the standard time and thereafter the clock can be stopped (within reason say for at least 15 minutes) depending on the standards of the enclosure. After all we stop counting travel distance in a protected route.

 
 If we can get someone two fire doors away from the fire we could even consider PHE .

 

Offline Fishy

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Re: Message from Mr.P and a query about means of escape for disabled people
« Reply #2 on: February 07, 2012, 11:53:12 AM »
The principle is that the disabled person should not be exposed to a significantly greater fire risk than any of the other building occupiers.  Therefore, if you can reasonably argue that they are either able to self-evacuate at the same time as the rest of the occupiers, or that there will be an assisted evacuation out of the risk area to a refuge or place of safety either with or at the tail-end of the evacuation of everyone else, then I'd suggest that would be sufficient.  

If the initial evacution is to a refuge, you then have to be able to credibly describe how they will reach a place of safety (with management assistance, if necessary), without relying upon assistance from the fire brigade etc.  You have to be able to describe how this happens reasonably swiftly, & if there is likely to be any appreciable delay the disabled person should either be attended or have a means of communicating with those managing their evacuation.  Such delays must be minimised, & assuming that the fact that you have (say) 30 minutes fire separation means you have 30 mins to evacuate them is not, of course, correct - evacuation from the refuge should be completed much more swiftly than this.

PHE is fine, so long as the fire protection is up to scratch & you can iterate how it'll be managed - effectively it uses the adjacent compartment as a large refuge, & the same comments as regards management & communication apply.

Offline kurnal

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Re: Message from Mr.P and a query about means of escape for disabled people
« Reply #3 on: February 09, 2012, 07:05:52 PM »
Response received from Mr.P
 
Thanks Kurnal & Fishy. I have a pretty good handle on this project - all but handed over now. 2 storey purpose built 30 bed unit with small kitchens and community rooms for persons with various disabilities. A lift which sadly is non FF. L1 detection. Plenty of stairs with refuge points and, compartmentation to allow for PHE should the RP choose (current intention is for immediate evacuation). Day & night staff (although reduced at night for specific care & safety).
 
Regards
 
Mr. P