Author Topic: Fuel station fire protection;  (Read 10515 times)

Offline Psuedonym

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 315
Fuel station fire protection;
« on: July 14, 2013, 08:35:15 AM »
Hi guys

Are there any specifics for extinguisher etc, cover for fuel stations that fuel station companies specify? E.G. number per fuel dispensers (pumps)/ tank storage limitations (petrol, LGP) ?
UKPIA don't mention it within the course so I wondered if it is provider specific or down to standard BS requirements?

Thanks
Ansul R102 Kitchen Suppression Enthusiast


Created using refurbished electrons to ensure I do my bit to save the planet...Polar bear cubs saved so far:2.75. Reduced due to effects of Carbon Footprint on the carpet. It's a bugger to shift...

Offline Tom Sutton

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2287
Re: Fuel station fire protection;
« Reply #1 on: July 14, 2013, 10:35:32 AM »
You could try HS(G)41 but it looks like HSE have withdrawn it? Send me your email and I can send you a copy. (some problems)
All my responses only apply to England and Wales and they are an overview of the subject, hopefully it will point you in the right direction and always treat with caution.

Offline mailkaz

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 8
Re: Fuel station fire protection;
« Reply #2 on: July 14, 2013, 03:31:58 PM »

Offline Tom Sutton

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2287
Re: Fuel station fire protection;
« Reply #3 on: July 14, 2013, 08:32:29 PM »
The guidance currently available, both from HSE and elsewhere, will need reviewing e.g.
HSG 146 – Risk Assessments at Filling Stations
HSG 41 – Construction/Operation of a Filling Station
APEA Blue Book. (However the blue book has been revised 2011 but doesn't come cheap.)

Check out  www.pei.org/FRD/APEA_e85.pdf and I am not sure LPG filling station are covered by the above CoP.


All my responses only apply to England and Wales and they are an overview of the subject, hopefully it will point you in the right direction and always treat with caution.

Offline Psuedonym

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 315
Re: Fuel station fire protection;
« Reply #4 on: July 14, 2013, 09:24:40 PM »
That's great, cheers guys,

I'm going to call SMTS tomorrow to see if they've anything we should be aware of regarding a couple of providers who I think their guys may have dealt with or hopefully have some contacts with who they can pass on for any particular supplier specific requirements.

Thanks again  ;)
Ansul R102 Kitchen Suppression Enthusiast


Created using refurbished electrons to ensure I do my bit to save the planet...Polar bear cubs saved so far:2.75. Reduced due to effects of Carbon Footprint on the carpet. It's a bugger to shift...

Offline AnthonyB

  • Firenet Extinguisher Expert
  • Global Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2480
    • http://www.firewizard.co.uk
Re: Fuel station fire protection;
« Reply #5 on: July 14, 2013, 10:54:23 PM »
The readily available guidance is way out of date:

Up to 4 pumps - 2 x extinguishers minimum rated 34B (yes only 34B!) with foam being at least  9 litres, powder 4.5kg
For up to each additional 2 - another 1

I would expect there is some more up to date stuff in the industry, however what I see does reflect the above with most filling stations having two pumps per row, each pump capable of being used from each side so equal to 4 pumps and each row thus having a fire point stand of 2 extinguishers and sand buckets, but instead of using 34B rating stick to either 6 kg Powder or 6 litre AFFF Spray.

I do remember that you could have your preference of all foam, all powder or a mix as long as they were compatible - unless you had LPG pumps in which case everything should be powder.

The HSE guidance looks like it was based on the 1970's and Protein Foam & BC Powder extinguishers, with some adjustment in the 80's for BS5423 (adding ratings and metrifiying capacities)

Anthony Buck
Owner & Fire Safety Consultant at Fire Wizard


Extinguisher/Fire History Enthusiast

Fire Extinguisher Facebook Group:
http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=65...415&ref=ts
http://www.youtube.com/user/contactacb
https://uk.linkedin.com/in/anthony-buck-36

Offline kurnal

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 6489
    • http://www.peakland-fire-safety.co.uk
Re: Fuel station fire protection;
« Reply #6 on: July 15, 2013, 06:50:26 AM »
The red guide may be of interest but refers to the APEA blue book for specifics on FFE.

http://www.energyinst.org/filegrab/?ref=1317&f=the-red-guide.pdf

A few years ago there was concern in respect of unleaded petrol and fire fighting equipment - I think some of the solvents added caused the rapid breakdown of foam?  I cant remember if the outcome had any consequences in respect of provision of extinguishers though.

Offline AnthonyB

  • Firenet Extinguisher Expert
  • Global Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2480
    • http://www.firewizard.co.uk
Re: Fuel station fire protection;
« Reply #7 on: July 15, 2013, 08:25:22 PM »
There was a lot of concern when unleaded and LRP first arrived and there were plenty of news stories (& even some actual live fire test footage from Brigades) showing foam & halon performing poorly and only powder making inroads into an unleaded fire.

I believe the make up of the UL blends in the UK are not too aggressive on AFFF and so the use of AFFF & eco foam extinguishers on the shallow spills associated with portables and forecourts isn't a worry.

If I knew the staff on a particular site would get the right training I'd mix powder & AFFF, the former for rapid knockdown and the latter for cooling, post extinction security and use on spills to prevent ignition.
 
Anthony Buck
Owner & Fire Safety Consultant at Fire Wizard


Extinguisher/Fire History Enthusiast

Fire Extinguisher Facebook Group:
http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=65...415&ref=ts
http://www.youtube.com/user/contactacb
https://uk.linkedin.com/in/anthony-buck-36

Offline Tom Sutton

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2287
Re: Fuel station fire protection;
« Reply #8 on: July 15, 2013, 08:42:40 PM »
Dry power the answer check out the video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ioT7CdmfbWQ  :o
All my responses only apply to England and Wales and they are an overview of the subject, hopefully it will point you in the right direction and always treat with caution.

Offline John Webb

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 838
Re: Fuel station fire protection;
« Reply #9 on: July 15, 2013, 09:10:14 PM »
Just some historic information 'for the record'. The Fire Experimental Unit did work on unleaded petrol around 1991/2 - a letter from Dr Martin Thomas was published in FIRE in the May 1992 issue. He also points out the increase in plastics in vehicles occurring at that time, as highlighted by my then-colleague Stan Ames at an IFE Car Fire seminar held in March 1992.

John Webb
John Webb
Consultant on Fire Safety, Diocese of St Albans
(Views expressed are my own)

Offline lancsfirepro

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 175
Re: Fuel station fire protection;
« Reply #10 on: July 16, 2013, 08:00:17 AM »
Dry power the answer check out the video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ioT7CdmfbWQ  :o
Now that is funny.  ;D  Didn't know you could get powder extinguishers with a bomb lance!