Your Opinions Please

[Firewolf]

Forgive me as there is already a very similar thread that has been posted about retained fire crews today but I decided to start of a new one for reasons which will become clear.

Im currently A fire safety inspecting officer with a large metro brigade. My neighbouring village is covered by a shire brigade which desperately needs extra retained firefighters.

However my station commander has stated that he would not allow me to undertake retained duties in my own time.

I can see his point - for instance could I be late for work thru attending an incident during the night?, could i arrive to work tired etc. I certainly do not wish to upset him, but I also really would like to help out my community. What should I do?

What are your opinions - does anyone know if my ADO can under employment laws tell me that I can't go retained - can anyone give me a defence to tactfully sell the idea to my ADO and get him to change his mind?

Thanks

[Game on]

I would ask your ADO how he thinks the 99.9% of retained firefighters accross the country manage when they have to go to work the next day feeling tired etc. You won't be the first and definately won't be the last!
With most brigades desperate for retained firefighters I would have thought that your ADO would positively encourage you to join. Do you think its because you are with a metropolitan brigade and they don't have much to do with the retained service?

[fireftrm]

Your station manager is unlikely to be able to make the decision. What is your FRS policy on secondary employment? We would allow you to pursue a RDS job in another FRS, or our own. Adjoining services have the same policy. However we do not allow persons of SM and above secondary employment under normal conditions as they are all on the flexi-duty system. We would also require any day duty staff to take 8 hours free from RDS duty prior to any shift, so should you be a day duty FS WM or Sm then you could only provide RDS cover from say 18:00 to 00:00 weekdays and until 00:00 on a Sunday. Few of my RDS vacancies would be suitable for such availability. It is usual for Wt staff on RDS statiosn to be those on shift system duty so that they provide 3.5 days of RDS cover as a minimum, they do give day cover so are of use. Weekend and evening only cover is of limited benefit.

I would ask for your FRS policy on this and determine what cover you can actually give - if it is as little as I suggest then I doubt you would be of much real benefit at the station anyway, sorry. For other staff the FRS policy needs to be open and clear an I would expect that your service would allow RDS duty in other, or your FRS - if they don't now then some words in the right ears (adjoining FRS senior management) should move it along. Did here.

[Firewolf]

Your station manager is unlikely to be able to make the decision. What is your FRS policy on secondary employment? We would allow you to pursue a RDS job in another FRS, or our own. Adjoining services have the same policy. However we do not allow persons of SM and above secondary employment under normal conditions as they are all on the flexi-duty system. We would also require any day duty staff to take 8 hours free from RDS duty prior to any shift, so should you be a day duty FS WM or Sm then you could only provide RDS cover from say 18:00 to 00:00 weekdays and until 00:00 on a Sunday. Few of my RDS vacancies would be suitable for such availability. It is usual for Wt staff on RDS statiosn to be those on shift system duty so that they provide 3.5 days of RDS cover as a minimum, they do give day cover so are of use. Weekend and evening only cover is of limited benefit.

I would ask for your FRS policy on this and determine what cover you can actually give - if it is as little as I suggest then I doubt you would be of much real benefit at the station anyway, sorry. For other staff the FRS policy needs to be open and clear an I would expect that your service would allow RDS duty in other, or your FRS - if they don't now then some words in the right ears (adjoining FRS senior management) should move it along. Did here.

You are absolutely right ordinarily retained crews need more cover during the day rather than at night.

It's just rare on this occassion that the station in question has vancies for night and weekend cover.

Having spoken to our personnel section they have confirmed they wouldn't have a problem with me doing retained duties in principle, however it is all based on my ADO's approval. If my ADO still stays no then I'm stumped, with no course for appeal.

I'm not normally one to stamp my feet and throw the teddy out of the pram if things don't go my way!

Many people have said that what I do in my own time is my own business and to just carry on and try for the retained service anyway without informing my brigade, others have told me to be careful of that as I might get sacked!

Anyone got any other suggestions?

[ian gough]

Your ADO is on a 'sticky wicket' here. Indeed, quite out of date I feel.
Put your request in writing to the Chief Fire Officer but, out of politeness, let the ADO know that, having sought advice, you are unhappy with his decision and intend to take the matter further.
As an 'ex West Midlander' who also wished to do retained duties 'some time ago' and was similarly refused, you have my sympathy. Feel free to e-mail me if you need further advice, however, you could always ask your rep body for assistance. Even the FBU have had to change with the times!

[Rich]

Grab life by the horns, don't be bullied by your ADO.  Next thing you know he'll be telling what time you have to be in bed by on your off duty days!  As long as you are not contracted to be 'available' on your off duty days with your main employment and you are sensible with your availablity in the retained there shouldn't be a problem.

Your life out of work is yours and should not be dictated to by others.

[Firewolf]

Thanks very much for the kind advice.

Has been most helpful...

With a bit of luck my ADO will change his mind.