Real Fire Training

[mac999]

Does anyone have any experience of setting up and running exercises or training sessions off station using derelict/empty domestic properties particularly in locations where you have been able to set fire to the property or of props within the property? What problems had to be overcome with environmental issues such as smoke emissions and water run-off? I understand we can emit dark smoke as long as it's for training purposes but what about contaminated water?
I have a fair amount of experience as a trainer and running on-site exercises but this option has been offered to us to burn off station and it's too good a chance to pass up. Any advice on burn materials and environmental issues would be most welcome.

Cheers

[Tom Sutton]

Merseyside tried that many years ago and it resulted in the death of a fireman.

[docfin]

Mac999 I would be very careful about taking up this kind offer as the opportunities for things to go wrong are limitless. It is one thing to carry out live fire training in a controlled environment which has been risk assessed and quite another to do it in a derelict building. I am sure you are well aware of this and will not thank me for chucking in my opinions but there are many examples of this scenario ending in an unexpected accident. An accidental injury to a Ff in these situations can sometimes have far reaching effects in these days of litigation. Good luck.

[mac999]

Thanks for the warnings and they're noted.
This isn't just a short term objective it's part of the organisations plans to improve training for ops crews and to take them away to an extent from the sterile environment of the training centre.
When I said derelict buildings we're really talking about newly empty properties that are due for demolition. We'll obviously look at premises which come up to assess their suitability. We'll not use premises where there are holes in floors etc... and we're not going to burn the structure as such. We'll probably go along the lines of the scenarios that are run at the College where they use smoke bales or pallets in cribs. All premises and exercises will be fully risk assessed and we'll have the full entourage of safety observers and BAI's in attendance.
I'm trying to find out if those of you who have run things like this have come up against environmental or legal issues. We're looking into this just now but it would be interesting to find out from others any problems they had and how they were overcome if at all.

Thanks