Floor coverings and decoration in communal areas

[Drew]

Hi All,

I have a question relating to carpets and decoration in communal areas.

The building is a three storey block of flats with a protected lobby on each level leading to two flats (6 in total). The building is 10-12 years old and has carpets fitted throughout, it has been re-decorated twice already and is about to be done again. There is a single staircase of wooden construction and this leads to a single front door exit. There is emergency lighting in the stairwell and lobbies but no smoke detection, however each flat has mains linked detection and a fire resisting front door.
 
I have read through Lacors and the guidance notes for sleeping accomodation and need to clarify how it is possible to confirm that the carpets are compliant with B.S 4790 -1987 and the paint is compliant to class 0 without a bit of distructive investigation?

Would it be good practice to recommend that;

Any carpets laid before 1987 require replacement as they do not meet the current standard and because the building is post 1987 the carpets meet the required standard?

Any decorating of the communal areas should carry certification to confirm the decoration is to class o standard?

Any help would be most appriciated   

[Midland Retty]

Hi Drew

Are the communal areas sterile? Is there secure access to the block? what ignition sources are present within the common areas?

If there is litte to burn in the communal area and security is good I personally would not change the carpet. Its likely the carpet met 1987 standard if the property was only built 10 - 12 years ago anyway.

It is impossible to confirm unless you know who manufactured the carpet and checked with them, or you had any form of certification supplied with it.

As you suggested it would be a good idea to recommend that any major redecoration is undertaken to class 0 standard.

[Davo]

Midland  thingy

Are you saying the one coat of Class 0 will prevent fire getting to the other coats of paint?


davo

[Drew]

Hi Midland/Davo,

The communal areas are sterile and the block has a door entry system so unless it's delberate fire setting or a cigarette dropped on the stairs the risk is fairly low, but the walls concern me as Davo suggests, how could you confirm class o apart from a complete redecoration job?

[Midland Retty]

Hiya Drew

You cant confirm if it is class 0 at present. You would need to specifiy that any new redecoration is to class 0 standard. This should take into account previous wall covering and the amount of layers. If there is any doubt the decorators would need to strip the previous layers and then apply a fresh coat.

There are some specialist products available which can be applied over existing layers, but from memory the manufacturer will state it can oly be used in certain circumstances. They may for instance only guarantee it will work up to a certain thickness (ie it can be applied up to a maximum of three layers of existing paint)

Cant remember the location but there is widely circulated research and pictures of a block of flats where despite the walls being covered with paint achieving class 0 fire was able to penetrate, and subsequently spread along, the older layers of paint underneath. The blaze spread to most parts of the common areas at an alarming rate.

[Drew]

Hey Midland,

So I guess it's a program of redecoration and therefore setting the risk as low as reasonble practical. In the case you mention, if the FRA for that building didn't raise a concern with the communal areas and the fire spread rapidly could the poor risk assessor be prosecuted for not picking up on the layers of old paint underneath?

Or am I getting paranoid (again!)
 

[Midland Retty]

Hi Drew

It would depend on a number of things, but yes the relevant enforcing authority can prosecute "competent persons" as well as responsible persons.

Risk assessment is not an easy thing despite what some people say. It is by no means a black and white issue and any investigation which looks at the failings of a competent person has to prove that they were at fault. This is by no means straightforward either.

Consider ignition sources, consider the likelyhood of fire occurring in common areas, consider the likelyhood of a fire from any flat impinging onto the  means of escape and being able to spread quickly, is it a real issue? does it warrant immediate action?

You need to decide how much of a risk it really is, and if it needs addressing quickly.

I would suggest it does not from what you describe and it might be appropriate to recommend that when the premises are next redecorated it is done so to the relevant standard. However clearly i havent seen the premises.

The case study into the fire  within the block of flats found multiple layers of paint (cant remember exactly how many layers but it was substantial)

[kurnal]

And the problem was the paint layers de-laminating allowing fire to spread behind the delaminating layers. The sort of thing you get in old buildings with multiple layers of old oil based gloss are then covered over with modern emulsions.

Personally I would have a little dig at the surface somewhere unseen. I would look for how easily the paint layers peel off each other and for signs of multiple old layers of gloss. It it appeared to be mainly distemper, eggshell, emulsions and did not peel easily I would not lose any sleep over it. As one of those midland based individuals said, its most important to make sure the common staircase remains sterile and the doors in good conditon.

[Clevelandfire 3]

Absolutely right. If it has only been decorated twice i would not be too concerned. I doubt that in a building of that age oil based paint were used and also you have to be realistic and ask what is going to set fire to it anyway.

The block of flat Midland wotsit talks about had external balconies and being exposed to the element was found to have contributed to the conflagration. Security was none existant and the fire was arson. There were something like 10 layers of paint applied over the years and it was damage to the surface that allowed the flames to penetrate the layers underneath.

[Drew]

Thank you all for your input, Ive had an unseen dig at the paintwork and there are no multiple layers or flaking. That puts my mind at rest!
The RP will now put a program in place to prevent a build up of layers, and a re carpeting program will also be rolled out .

Another risk lowered.

Best regards

Drew

[Midland Retty]

"A re-carpeting program will be rolled out ?" *groans*

[nearlythere]

"A re-carpeting program will be rolled out ?" *groans*

I think that should just about cover it.

[rn976]

For info if required in future

Report by Dr Janet Murrel and Patrick Rawlins for Warrington Fire
Fire Hazard of Multilayer Paint Surfaces
I think this was published about 1996

rn976