Author Topic: Risk Assessments  (Read 45411 times)

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« Reply #45 on: August 13, 2004, 01:41:30 PM »
Hi James, thanks for that explanation of why Scotland is going its own way. I didnt realise that!  However as a scotsman who is now an Englishman ( I did work in Scotland for over 13 years so figure that one out!) I am not too sure that that is correct otherwise why didn't they just copy out the RRO as a seperate Bill, never underestimate the stregth of a Scottish Parliament and its ambitions, and by the way good luck to to them
Cheers
BOB

Offline colin todd

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« Reply #46 on: August 14, 2004, 06:59:46 PM »
Robert, The reply to your query is correct. The Reg Ref Act only applies in E&W. And who the hell would want to copy out the crap produced by the ODPM in the form of the Order anyway! It is just as easy in the case of Scotland to produce primary legislation. Wee B, you forgot to mention one thing in the attention you drew to the appeals process. You can only use it if you agree that there is a non compliance with legislative requirements and it is simply a matter of a dispute as to how to fix it. It is clear from all the comments in the boards on FRAs (and from common experience) that it is more likely that someone says in an FRa that all is well and the fire authority disagree. Under these circumstances, you cannot use tha non-Court route, as you have not agreed that there is any breach in legislation. So, while I acknowledge the sentiment that, at most, there is only one good thing in the Order, in reality it is only half a good thing!
Colin Todd, C S Todd & Associates

Offline wee brian

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« Reply #47 on: August 14, 2004, 07:08:25 PM »
Fair comment. I was very disapointed to see the wording in relation to appeals.

You could probably agree that a failure existed but propose a very minor solution to it. Its pants but may be the only way round it.

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« Reply #48 on: August 15, 2004, 07:22:47 PM »
Hi Colin Crap!!! from the ODPM? that is heresy, obviously you havent read the Scotland (Fire) Bill, more crap than you can throw a stone at, indeed its as parsimonious as the Scottish Parliament building!!!!!! when will Scotland ever learn theat they are part (only a small part at that) of the UK and Gt Britain and the EU.  When they learn that lesson then maybe we will have a bit of common sense
Cheers
BOB

Offline colin todd

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« Reply #49 on: August 15, 2004, 08:49:35 PM »
Robert, I have read the draft Bill. I took it on hols with me and read it in the Bahamas sunshine. It bored the hell out of me, but I have to say I liked it more than what I repeat for avoidance of doubt is the crap produced by the Old Dozey Post Menopausal people. For a start, those drafting the Bill had the courage and intellect not merely to copy out the Eurospeak of the EU Directives, unlike their English colleagues. You may also note the subtle difference in the wording relating to determination of disputes by the Minister. It is permissible to seek determination if the enforcing authority consider there to be a breach of duty. In the English version you have to put your hands up to a breach first of all, as agreed by my right honourable friend the Wee B. (Am I reading more into this than there is?) With regard to Scotland, Robert, we gave you the telephone, penicillin, the steam engine and a broader superior education system. Now, you have the Bill. What more do you want? What's parsimonious about it anyway? Why would you throw a stone at crap? And how can you say the Parliament building is parsimonious given the cost of it?
Colin Todd, C S Todd & Associates

Chris Houston

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« Reply #50 on: August 16, 2004, 10:38:10 PM »
Quote
Hi Colin Crap!!! from the ODPM? that is heresy, obviously you havent read the Scotland (Fire) Bill, more crap than you can throw a stone at, indeed its as parsimonious as the Scottish Parliament building!!!!!! when will Scotland ever learn theat they are part (only a small part at that) of the UK and Gt Britain and the EU.  When they learn that lesson then maybe we will have a bit of common sense
Cheers
BOB


Bob,

FireNet exists to discuss fire related issues.  Can I suggest that if you feel the need to debate such issues as the Scottish people or our Parliament, you start up a separate thread in the Dinosaur forum?  Should you wish to do this, please bring an atlas (Re: Scotland being a small part of the UK) and a dictionary (Re: use of parsimonious.)  ;)

Sincerely,

Chris Houston.

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« Reply #51 on: August 18, 2004, 10:05:42 AM »
Quote
Quote
Hi Colin Crap!!! from the ODPM? that is heresy, obviously you havent read the Scotland (Fire) Bill, more crap than you can throw a stone at, indeed its as parsimonious as the Scottish Parliament building!!!!!! when will Scotland ever learn theat they are part (only a small part at that) of the UK and Gt Britain and the EU.  When they learn that lesson then maybe we will have a bit of common sense
Cheers
BOB


Bob,

FireNet exists to discuss fire related issues.  Can I suggest that if you feel the need to debate such issues as the Scottish people or our Parliament, you start up a separate thread in the Dinosaur forum?  Should you wish to do this, please bring an atlas (Re: Scotland being a small part of the UK) and a dictionary (Re: use of parsimonious.)  ;)

Sincerely,

Chris Houston.

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« Reply #52 on: August 18, 2004, 10:13:31 AM »
Hi Chris sorry about that I will stick to the topics in future, however, my use of the word parsimonious was correct given that I was using it in a jokey,nay, ironic way, but Colin and yourself seemed to have missed the irony!!  my reference to Scotland was demographically based rather than geographic. Anyway, thanks for re-focussing me and thanks to Colin et al for the explananation re the two pieces of legislation, I now know why
Cheers
BOB

Chris Houston

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« Reply #53 on: August 18, 2004, 02:56:27 PM »
OK - I forgive you,  :P thousands wouldn't :lol:

PS On a serious note, do use the Dinosaur forum, it's not very well used at the moment............

Chris Houston

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« Reply #54 on: August 20, 2004, 12:12:46 PM »
Quote
Robert, The reply to your query is correct. The Reg Ref Act only applies in E&W. And who the hell would want to copy out the crap produced by the ODPM in the form of the Order anyway! It is just as easy in the case of Scotland to produce primary legislation. Wee B, you forgot to mention one thing in the attention you drew to the appeals process. You can only use it if you agree that there is a non compliance with legislative requirements and it is simply a matter of a dispute as to how to fix it. It is clear from all the comments in the boards on FRAs (and from common experience) that it is more likely that someone says in an FRa that all is well and the fire authority disagree. Under these circumstances, you cannot use tha non-Court route, as you have not agreed that there is any breach in legislation. So, while I acknowledge the sentiment that, at most, there is only one good thing in the Order, in reality it is only half a good thing!


So does anybody know (or can anyone suggest) what will happen in Scotland, if anything?  Will similar legislation probably be passed?

Offline logan_lewis

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« Reply #55 on: August 20, 2004, 01:10:35 PM »
The approach in Scotland is slightly different...as has been said, most of what they are doing - including fire safety legislation - is part of the Fire (Scotland) Bill.  See:

http://www.scotland.gov.uk/News/Releases/2004/06/5738

The (draft) Fire (Scotland) Bill already contains things which the Fire Safety Order for E&W proposes.  However, if the Bill (becoming an Act) does not cover all that is needed for fire safety, secondary legislation could be passed under powers in the (proposed) Act, which may resemble parts of the Fire Safety Order for E&W.