Fire exit via roller shutter

[Chris Houston]

I'd be happy to hear some comments on one case that I've been thinking about over the weekend.

A fire escape route goes through a warehouse and the final exit is through a roller shutter door.  The door is usually open, but is closed at night, at the same time the building is retail and therefore has customers in it.  

The fire brigade have visited and said that the shutter must be interfaced with the fire alarm system so that it goes up upon activation.

I'm still not convinced this covers all angles as loss of power to the motor that raises the shutter may occur during a fire.

The shutters are about 5m wide by 10m high and I suspect to heavy to be lifted by a battery powered motor....although if this were possible, would others accept this?

There is no where that doors could be installed next to the shutters due to the layout.  I think they need to put doors in the shutters that can be easily opened from the inside.  This may be difficult and expensive, but I can't think of any other solution.

Ideas anyone?

[jokar]

Chris,

I would concur with you.  My first thoughts as I read were that a door needs to be placed within the shutter of an adequate width to enable the number of people present to escape.

[kurnal]

Wicket doors in roller shutters tend to have a very high threshold and are generally narrow, usually recommended for low numbers of staff, generally not considered suitable for use by the public. And no good at all for wheelchair users.

Other solutions may be to counterbalance the shutter door to allow battery operation, but even so I would look at the liklihood of a large number of customers arriving at the door simultaneously leading to potential panic situation.  

I think you are right, for retail use I think if practicable a conventional outward opening door should be provided - does the shutter need to be 5m wide or could the opening be narrowed to say 3.5m wide to enable the opening to also accommodate conventional doors?

[Colin Newman]

You could consider a horizontal shutter.  There's a product called Wondor FireGuard that's made in America, but distrubuted in the U.K. by Beehive Folding Partitions Ltd. (http://www.beehive-partitions.com) The product is a double skinned metal folding partition that extends from a wall pocket to close an opening of "virtually any width" and a height of upto 7m.  Once closed, those needing to escape from a fire can press an integral push bar which activates the door meachanism retrating the door a predetermined width for a predetermined time before re-closing.  The door controls and drive mechanism are fully monitored and battery backed.  I'm not sure how well it will provide security for the warehouse, but I know they have other products aimed at security so it might be worth checking them out.

I hasten to add that I have no connection at all with this company or product, just trying to be helpful and profer a potential solution.

[Chris Houston]

There could potentially be large numbers of people involved here (although I think in reality most will probably try and escape the same way they came in, even if this is the nearest exit) and wheelchair users could be amongst them.  I'm starting to think that putting in a narrower shutter with double doors next to it is the only solution.

[kurnal]

You could leave the shutter in situ for security purposes and create gate like hinged panels side hung inside the line of the shutter that incorporates a door frame and conventional exits. The hinged panel need not be full height- the shutter can be pulled down to say 2.5m and whilst the public are in the building the hinged inner panels are put in place. You could make one side of the hinged gate 2m wide incoprorating a 1.6m outward opening double leaf exit door and the other side could be divided in the centre and hinged to fold back on itself. You achieve all needs- easy exit for the public, security when closed and ease of access when needed for loading.

[jasper]

my father in law has premises where there is a door opening within the actual shutter

[kurnal]

Jasper
Is it a narrow wicket door with a high threshold you have to step over?
This type of door is often used for small numbers of employees but I would say unsuitable for an exit used by the public in a retail environment.

[jasper]

Jasper
Is it a narrow wicket door with a high threshold you have to step over?
This type of door is often used for small numbers of employees but I would say unsuitable for an exit used by the public in a retail environment.

yes mate that is the type of door; however you could argue that the door is open at all times during occupation of the public and when the premises is closed at night then only a small number of staff are present (just an idea)

[Chris Houston]

That arguement does not work in my scenario as the public can be there 24 hours and may be wheelchair users.

[Mr. P]

To change to the concertena type would be quite expensive, but I have seen many with one or two portions (depending on width of fold leaf) identified as  emergency exit with suitable hardware to satisfy ease of use/security.  This way access/egress is suitable for all users.
I guess a cost comparison will be needed between new shutter/ hitching up to alarm, battery back up and long term maintenance

[PhilB]

Could the roller shutter be kept open when the premises are open to the public?

[Davo]

Chris

Presumably deliveries are received through the shutter. Putting my H &S head on, do vans etc back up to a bay or similar to reduce manual handling? Is there any need in fact for a shutter at all? Or one of that size?

Back to fire head, distance of travel?, presumably a hatched out route is in place?

Easiest (Cheapest?) solution in my opinion is 2.5m ish high pair of fabricated gates, break glass warehouse side, blanking plate external to prevent access to the BGU from outside. Basically as per Kurnal and works in our warehouse

[Chris Houston]

To answer the questions.

Yes, it is hatched.

The public are in the place 24 hours.  Some sort of security is needed, but obvioulsy not at the expence of life safety.

[Bert]

I had a building with a similar situation. The roller shutter provided a means of escape for an underground loading bay, a gym, and a restaurant /bar. The shutter remained open and manned by a security officer for most of the day and although it was closed at night and weekends, it opened automatically upon activation of the alarm.

The shutter was powered via the mains electrical supply which was backed up by a generator. In addition, a manual over ride facility was provided which consisted of a chain and pulley system. The chain was painted green, and clearly labelled (with a sign on the wall) as to its purpose. This was approved by the local Fire authority and building control officer.

When the shutter was eventually replaced the new one operated in a similar fashion, but was counter balanced so that operating the chain override released a lock and the shutter moved up under the influence of the counter balance.

The building had AFD to L2 standard and sprinklers in the basement areas.