FSO v Housing Act.

[Harry11]

A friend has recently purchased a 3 storey premises with two flats on each floor.  

He has received an improvement notice (Housing Act) from the local council asking for Grade A LD2 in the common parts, Grade D in the dwellings, HD in all kitchens and lobbies to flats, EL in common areas etc etc.

Seems a bit OTT but guidance under the FSO refers to self contained SD in dwellings and not much else.

He has received a quote in the region of £4,500 to comply with the Order.

Can he argue that the legislation covering the premises is the FSO and not the Housing Act

TIA

[nearlythere]

A friend has recently purchased a 3 storey premises with two flats on each floor.  

He has received an improvement notice (Housing Act) from the local council asking for Grade A LD2 in the common parts, Grade D in the dwellings, HD in all kitchens and lobbies to flats, EL in common areas etc etc.

Seems a bit OTT but guidance under the FSO refers to self contained SD in dwellings and not much else.

He has received a quote in the region of £4,500 to comply with the Order.

Can he argue that the legislation covering the premises is the FSO and not the Housing Act

TIA

How did the Council get involved that resulted in an improvement notice? Is it an HMO?

[jokar]

The local authority have the power of improvement and prohibition under the Housing Act and issue notices to confirm the housing rating system.  The FSO only applies to common areas and will be enforced by whomever, an enforcer, if they wish to.  A number of FRS have MOU with the Local Authority to allow them to deal with Housong Act premisesand they are completely within their rights to do so.  Your friend will have to comply or appeal against the notice.

[Eggcustard]

Assuming a conservative estimate of 100,000 pounds per flat would value the block at 600,000 pounds. And he is looking for a loophole to avoid paying an additional 0.75 percent on fire safety which equates to 750 pound per flat. Over the top? Sounds bloody reasonable to me. How many times do people come on here looking for ways to avoid paying money as opposed to identifying cost effective measures to ensure tenant safety (and relevant persons) is suitably provided for.

[Galeon]

Most people will walk up to a fence and stop , the minority will charge at it and end up bouncing off.

[Rex]

Harry 11
Depends if the flats conform to current Building Regulations, if not common parts to be covered by Grade A LD2,  and flats by a GRADE D LD2,  but if the flats are modern and conform to the  required compartmentation of Building Regulations doors, walls, & ceilings,   a common alarm would not be required as the standard of fire safety with regards to the design & construction is at a safer level than an older building. In this case only a GRADE D LD2 for the flats would normally be recommended. The notice already served on the building would indicate that it is an older building that would require the necessary higher standard of fire safety in relation to fire detection and probably compartmentation that should be provided. To argue what legislation covers the building would not help your friend, costings could be very similar, safety of the occupants is the ultimate aim.

[Izan FSO]

Most people will walk up to a fence and stop , the minority will charge at it and end up bouncing off.

?? is this an Eric Cantona thing

[Wiz]

Izan, Is that the 'banter police'* I see arriving in the distance ready to deal with the above comment

Or will it be for this one?

* See posts under different thread!

[CivvyFSO]

Can he argue that the legislation covering the premises is the FSO and not the Housing Act

Quite simply, no.

The fact that it needs EL in the common areas would point out to me that it does not comply with recent building regs, and as such the alarm standard being asked for is possibly reasonable.

If you can show that compartmentation between floors/flats is to current ADB standard and also the venting of the staircase is to ADB standard, then you could have a case for just installing EL and grade D within apartments.

As others have pointed out, both pieces of legislation aim to achieve the safety of people in the flats, if the alarm system is required due to the features of the premises then it would be required regardless of the legislation applicable. One difference you may find is the the local authority officers often (not always before someone jumps on me) do not have the same understanding of fire safety as the FRS, and if they are given a prescriptive standard (Which many have) then they will stick to that. They (In a similar vein to building control) have many other things to worry about besides fire, so they maybe want to deal with that aspect nice and quick then they can spend more time worrying about trips, damp, cold, noise, light and all other things that contribute to (Or lower) the quality of life in the flats.

[FSO]

Generally the LHA will take the lead on standalone HMOs and flats as per the CFOA protocol.