IFPO and/or IFSM

[hammer1]

Afternoon all, after a long period of just observing this good site, I have decided to descend myself into the lions den.

My first question to the great ones is I have recently joined IFPO and IFSM at Tech level, and just wondered what peoples views are on these Institutions  and are they value for money, the IFPO magazine looks informative and I have already been to a free seminar and had offers of discount courses.

Have read/heard a lot about the IFE and some people sounding that it is fading fast as a institution and is to much of a 'boys own' club and not to keen  on 'outsiders'  ??

Anyway happy Christmas all and here is to plenty of posts for the new year.

I am not worthy..........

[kurnal]

Hi Hammer1
The IFE welcomes applications from all in the industry, theres a fair bit of mud slinging goes on amongst the various institutions, the criticism of the IFE comes mainly from those set up to compete and the best advice is to duck. Or grouse. Theres a lot of angry people around, who  waste so much time slagging each other off, personally I believe you should join whichever organisation you feel makes the greatest overall contribution to the Industry and to its members.

May I wish you a very happy Christmas and extend a very warm welcome to the forum.

[Thomas Brookes]

Hello Hammer1,
welcome to this forum.
Sometimes this site can be like going into the Lions den, just try to remember sometimes the written word seems a lot more harsh than it was ment if it had been spoken. So sometime you may feel that someone is having a go at you when really they are not. And looking the other way try to read your own posts twice before posting it.

Any way you will find people are always bias if they belong to a certain body or not, I am a little Bias against the IFE because I had a bad experience when I enquired about membership last year. Mainly because the lady who took the enquirey made me feel small for enquiring as I was not from the fire service back ground. HOWEVER some of the chaps on here are great people who belong to the IFE and have told me that my problem with them was  an isolated incedent.
Depends what qualifications and experence you have on really where you can join or not, a good health and safety body is IOSH www.iosh.co.uk and this is far more well know outside the fire industry. The prob
lem with a lot of the Fire bodies, apart from people in the fire industry no one has heard of it. 

As a little test, ask a few people may be safety officers at companys you know or may be your local fire officers and ask which bodies they have heard of and then give them a look.

Back to IFE, I would never say never. If it was to my companies or my benefit I would join tomorrow.
 

[colin todd]

There is no issue of the IFE looking down on those without fire service backgrounds, and I find it difficult to believe that any of the full time staff at HQ would have such a view, as they have no axe to grind in this respect. Those who see the IFE as an old boys club are about 20 years out of date.  The IFE is the only professional fire safety body licensed by the Engineering Council to register qualified engineers at engineering technician level, incorporated engineer and chartered engineer. This sets the Institution aside from all others, regardless of how good and worthy they may be. IFPO, for example, do a good job for their members.

[ashleyLFC]

I fully endorse Colin's post, the IFE continues to go from strength to strength, not least in its external accreditations with OfQual and Eng Council Uk.  It appears to me that you may have misinterpreted to head office advice last year, maybe they mis-understood your enquiry.  Again I have no doubt they single out fire services as their membership base.  I for one recommend the IFE as the professional body for both fire service personnel and fire protection/safety consultants/advisor, its membership is widely recognised by the fire industry professional, so you will be in good hands!
I too though have applied to join IFPO, having been to a recent seminar of theirs, plus see the IFSM risk register as a thought (but looks remarkably like the IFE's risk register application!!, but maybe it won't be as closed shop as the IFE's register application process, as I have experinced recently..I'll let that comment settle!) 
I'd IFE it.

[Clevelandfire 3]

IFe is very good. The iron curtain old boys network image it had went decades ago. It is a well run organisation and can open several doors.

I've heard both the IFPO and IFSM are good too, but for the reasons already mentioned the IFE is probably the best. If you can afford to do so why not go for all three on an annual trial and see which one gives you the most benefit.

[Thomas Brookes]

I think Clevelandfire 3 has a good point, Is there anyone on hee who is in all three bodies willing to give an unbias report on all three

[colin todd]

While I endorse Ashley's endorsement of my endorsement, I would like to say that the IFE register of fire risk assessors and auditors is in no way a closed shop, and it is the most mature (in the sense of long standing) and largest of the several registers that exist. I would not want any misconceptions about it to discourage people from applying.

[Allen Higginson]

I have made an initial query to my local branch regarding membership - any clues as to what this involves (the donning of hoods and exposing body parts is hopefully precluded!!)

[colin todd]

Membership is of the parent body. Then you get the local branch as a small extra.  The branch membership does not involve anything at all. It is the parent body membership you really need. See the ife website for more info, or buy me loads of bush while we go through the paperwork when i am next in the Province.

[Allen Higginson]

Membership is of the parent body. Then you get the local branch as a small extra.  The branch membership does not involve anything at all. It is the parent body membership you really need. See the ife website for more info, or by me loads of bush while we go through the paperwork when i am next in the Province.

Not a problem Colin as lomg as I don't have to go to that Garage place and you give me a bit of notice!!!

[fireftrm]

If you reside in the UK then your Institution membership fees include an element which passes to the local branch, so there is no membership application, or fee for your branch. It maybe that some branches have a residual fee to raise funds, but it isn't a membership fee, perhaps a payment for attending branch events?

As Colin has already said the IFE is nto a closed shop, or old boy's club, that image (and some of what was actually happening) went 20, or so, years ago and the Institution is fully recongnised within  e Engineering Council. I became the first 'other ranks' branch council member 15 years ago, even then the fact that the majority of members were senior FRS officers was not by design and all walks of the industry were made more than wlecome, At the same time the President of an adjoining branch was from the Fire Safety profession, with no LAFRS background at all. So the image was mainly created by outsiders, either through lack of understanding, jealousy, or for their own personal/organisational interest.

[Brian Downes]

Dear Hammer1
                   
My advice would be to join both IFE and IFSM! If you are going in as a 'Tech' I would think the fees of both organisations would be reasonable. I cannot speak for IFPO as I am not a member, although I have thought about going for the set!

I first joined the IFE back in the 70's and 80's before letting my membership lapse. I rejoined about 3 years ago.

When I rejoined IFE I was refreshed, the institution seemed to have changed a lot. I think it would probably be very unfair to level the 'Fire Service Officers Club' argument at it these days, although I must admit I am not an active 'Branch' member any more.

I would say that the IFE is still the premier organisation for the non-graduate fire engineer. The 'IFE Mag' now called 'Fire Risk Management', is an essential read for anyone in the profession; alas they never print the rubbish I write as it is far to controversial!

The IFE is large, worldwide, and has been around since 1918. Happily it seems to be going from strength to strength.
Given its august position though, I think it can be seen as very much part of the 'establishment', whatever that is.

The IFSM on the other hand strikes me as a smaller, friendlier, more informal, and dare I say it slightly radical organisation.

 I very much enjoy attending the IFSM's meetings and seminars when I can. I find them relevant, free, a valuable source of CPD, and fun! My perception is that the IFSM and its members are not afraid to ask awkward questions of the establishment!

I have not found either bodies to be biased against members who do not come from a local authority fire service background. Personally speaking, as a rank and file member from a fire service background, but now in the private sector; I think folks who come to fire enginering / fire safety from other professional backgounds should be welcomed as they make for a balanced organisation.

I am proud to be a member of both organisations and derive great benefit from each of them.

Brian Downes
MIFireE, MIFSM