Alarm sounders in communal areas

[davincey]

Hello all

I am looking into the possibility of changing the alarm sytems in our tower blocks and sheltered accomodation, to 'silent' systems with no sounders in the communal areas. I am currently upgrading the doors in all of these properties by fitting intumescent strips with smoke seals, intumescent letter boxes etc in line with our stay put plans.

I am liaising with the local frs on this matter but am interested in tapping into the font of knowledge on here and hearing the opinions of those esteemed members who care to offer them!!

[kurnal]

When you say a silent alarm, presumably linked to a call centre or other monitoring system?

Generally sheltered housing is treated differently to tower blocks- in my experience it is uncommon for a sheltered housing scheme to lend itself easily to a stay put policy, very often sheltered housing schemes have substantial fire loading and communal facilities linking onto the escape routes,  dead end conditions and a lack of fire compartmentation.

I agree that whilst a tower block built to CP3 or modern building regulations may not need any alarm at all in the common areas, if you put in a silent alarm that alerts a call centre this could be beneficial- if we are sure what the response is to be. The fire service may not be happy if the system generates a lot of unwanted signals and may seek some kind of management and monitoring of alarms..

[Big_Fella]

When you say no alarm sounders in the communal areas, are you indicating alarm sounders remain in occupants rooms etc?

[davincey]

Hi kurnal

I placed a small wager with myself that yours would be the first response! Hopefully you remember me and are therefore aware of where I am and the legacy I inherited!

All of our alarm systems are linked to a call centre, and i would say that compartmentalisation in all of our buildings is very good.

The biggest problem with our sheltered schemes is that when the alarms do go off, the residents tend to open their doors to see what is going on! The local frs are very much in favour of stay put and support the upgrade work to the doors.

There is also the ever present confusion over detection in communal areas!

And yes, Big Fella, there would be sounders in each flat. Our sheltered accomodation is independant living so each property consists of individual flats within a communal block and not HMO's

[kurnal]

Hi kurnal

I placed a small wager with myself that yours would be the first response! Hopefully you remember me and are therefore aware of where I am and the legacy I inherited!

Can I claim half your winnings then?
Hey look at this way- we could make a few bob here - keep making wagers with yourself, you would win every time and I would take 50% of your winnings. May even let Midland Retty take a cut too- hes always on the look out for a good investment.

Yes I remember your situation now. Your sheltered housing residents are absolutely typical in going and standing at the door to see whats going on. I always wonder at what stage in a fire they would make a decision and either go back in and seal the door or try and make their way out through the smoke?

And whether there would be any joint decisions or whether each would make up their own mind?

[CivvyFSO]

I would be in favour of a silent alarm so long as the building is of the correct standard, which this sounds like it is, or will be. If it is stay-put then the people are clearly better off not knowing to avoid the situation you point out, people investigating what is happening and potentially putting themselves at risk.

In the sheltered housing, to control 'unwanted signals', if the system is addressable then the receiving station could know the difference between an alarm in someones dwelling, and a second knock in the communal corridor. The latter clearly warranting an attendance by the Fire Service. (The prior still warranting investigation via telephone at least)

I am also in agreement with Kurnal regarding the tower blocks. Bear in mind that any detection already in place may also operate some vents, depending on the layout of the building.

[Big_Fella]

In the sheltered housing, to control 'unwanted signals', if the system is addressable then the receiving station could know the difference between an alarm in someones dwelling, and a second knock in the communal corridor. The latter clearly warranting an attendance by the Fire Service. (The prior still warranting investigation via telephone at least)

Indeed, would be a case of installing addressable interfaces, programmed to operate on either residents detecion or communal detection, then using two channels on your communicator (digi or redcare, what evers on the site) to send two separate signals.  This can then be identified by the monitoring station

[davincey]

Thank you all for your responses. As always intelligent, informed and inciteful!

I will definately think about your proposition kurnal.... it sounds like it could be a winner!!