It had to come, sooner or later!

[fireftrm]

Bravo

The North East referendum on regional govt did put the amalgamation back on the shelf, however that is not to say that the ODPM could not look to a regional service, the RMBs are still in place and where there is a political will, and a third term mandate who knows............

[rips]

recently heard that regionalisation will never happen just a very close working relationship between the 4 brigades. Certainly suits one as they never wanted to join together anyway!

[Cut Fire Service Pay]

Devon have had a civillian 'ACO' for ages.

[b217bravo]

What reference(s) does this "civilian" ACO hold?
Do they wear 'the' uniform, complete with rank markings?
How do the guys at the sharp end feel about having a 'civvie' ACO?. are they entitled to the courtesy of a salute & to be addressed as 'Sir' ?
Civilian staff have been with us since the dawn of time & I can see no objection to them being called Finance Directors, Human Resource Directors etc, etc, but for the life of me can't understand why they should be given a uniformed rank, in my opinion this dilutes the opportunity for promotion for career firefighters.
geoff

[colin todd]

No , most of them are addressed as ma'am. Anyhow speaking personally I have a penchant for women in uniform.

[oilybum]

Talk about 2 tier entry getting out of control. Suffolk now offer to train any civvy successful DCFO applicant up for operations!

DCFO NVQ?

20/07/2005 Deputy Chief Fire Officer (Assistant Director) Suffolk Fire and Rescue Service
Deputy Chief Fire Officer (Assistant Director)

Up to £80,000 depending on experience
More may be available for an exceptional candidate (pay award pending)


Change is a constant challenge, but it also provides a wealth of opportunities. In Suffolk, we recognise the necessity for dynamism and innovation to make change work for us. We have Public Protection services that we are proud of, but we need to improve continuously and further embed our modernisation programme. Changes to the Fire and Rescue Service will require more attention to be placed on partnership working and prevention activities. This period of transformation and improvement means that we need to respond to a changing environment.

To realise our aims we need an inspirational leader with the experience and skills to bring cultural change to our highly committed workforce, and the insight and confidence to make strong decisions about service improvements. You'll bring imagination, vision and an outstanding record in Public Protection. You'll have the breadth of experience and understanding of public sector priorities to think corporately. You'll show the depth of your commitment to public service by championing our corporate vision and taking full responsibility for initiatives and projects. You will be able to demonstrate your ability to co-ordinate responses to emergency situations. Above all, you must have the resolve to work tirelessly for the well-being and safety of the people of Suffolk.

The post requires an "on-call" arrangement and you will be required to attend operational incidents. If you are not already from a fire service background, appropriate training will be provided.

For an informal discussion, please contact the Director of Public Protection and Chief Fire Officer, Lee Howell, or the current Deputy Chief Fire Officer, Graham Smith on 01473 588969.

For a recruitment pack please telephone Suffolk County Council Recruitment (08456 014412) or email recruitment@csduk.com - please quote reference JM436.

CLOSING DATE: 20 JULY 2005

[dave bev]

geoff, saluting - where have you been!!!

there is at least one brigade where everyone calls the cfo by his first name - interesting times - what will happen to cfoa (cacfoa) as you prob know it when all the cfo's have no fire service background - how will they offer professional advice on technical issues, of course some will cope pretty well because thay may have 'other experiences' that give them the ability - but some others?

heard a rumour that one cfo has retired and joined another brigade as a non uniformed dep

anyone confirm (from middle england to a bit more southerly england is the only clue i can offer)


oily, interesting but not new. the issue is how long will the development programme be, what happens in the interim while they are on development and working within role?

interesting the advert doesnt say what will happen if the individual doesnt reach 'competency' in terms of completion and application of development programme learning.

i hope non uniformed cfo's/principle officers who havent progressed through the structure and therefore gained practical skill application are NOT being set up for prosecution under manslaughter/corporate killing  - leading a fire brigade IS different than managing a business!

i only hope for all concerned that any development process properly equips people for their role, whatever their background/position in the structure

dave bev

[ellitore]

Suffolk have the answer (DCFO vacency)

Quote:

"The post requires an 'on call' arrangement and you will be required to attend operational incidents.If you are not already from a fire service background, appropriate training will be given"

[oilybum]

Yep no experience necessary to take up an operational post that normally comes after about 20 years service, well apart from Suffolks current CFO. Come to think of it he jumped from ACFO to CFO. You see Suffolk can do it better than you yes they can. They can get a civvy up to speed operationally via a bit of training. Probably a NVQ in DCFO?

Frightening. But thats two tier entry taken to its logical conclusion!

[colin todd]

Can the CEO of Marconi assemble a printed circuit board. No? Bah more of that two tier entry business. No good will come of it, mark my words Mr Hudson. None of their computers will work.

[dave bev]

but would the ceo of marconi be making 'safety critical' decisions and instructing (cos we dont do ordering much nowadays, except in some brigades!) staff how to do their job?

i dont have any problem with ANY competent person making decsions appropriate to their competence - (but simulation is not acceptable to demonstrate competence for this unit!!)

are marconi as solvent as they once were colin? if theyre not (and many others aswell) wonder how that happened then, did their managers lose their hands on ability i wonder and concentrated purely on the beans and countermeasures of the wonderous world of human resource management?

dave bev

[colin todd]

The CEO does not advise on safety in the factory floor Davey. And when you get wise and become a capitalist and thereafter CFO of Essex (oh no it will be the whole of the east of England by then) you will not be telling the troops which way to point the hoses either I suspect. But even when you are that illustrious, there will still be a palce ofr you at our Xmas party.

[wee brian]

The CFO's that I have met are all quite happy to talk authoratively about things that they don't understand. So theres no need for any special experience.

[colin todd]

Working for your government mates is making you jaundiced Bri.

[mark nine]

I wonder how far down the rank structure a brigade could go on employing 'civilians', before it would have to employ an operational firefighter.