London Fire Brigade Strikes

[TallyHo]

The AssetCo firefighters were trained by Lincolnshire F&RS and I presume some of the training was carried out by members of the FBU. I'm surprised that the FBU didn't make more of a fuss about this.

[mr angry]

The AssetCo firefighters were trained by Lincolnshire F&RS and I presume some of the training was carried out by members of the FBU. I'm surprised that the FBU didn't make more of a fuss about this.

I questioned some fbu officials over this very issue to be told that no fbu members were involved in this training, so who then hmmmm....

[AnthonyB]

Privatisation is nothing new & has been in use in Europe for years, just look at Falck:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Falck

So if that is the long term goal there's enough precedent to support it.

Asset Co have bought up several manufacturers and leasers of ambulances, etc over recent years, running the fleet rather than just providing it could be their next natural step.

[Midland Retty]

But do we want a privatised service? Is there a danger that in the private sector profit comes before anything else?

And where do you draw the line? They supply police cars too, but do we want a private police force?

[nearlythere]

Is there a danger that in the private sector profit comes before anything else?

Always.

[seth119]

I thought they was already private police forces in the Uk. BTP Transport police paid for by the rail companies Habour police paid for by the habour boards MOD police paid for by the MOD.

[Cat]

Yes there are some private constabularies like the CNC (Nuclear Constabulary) and such like but the vast majority of them are still publicly funded.  To be honest a lot of the military police are still branches within the individual force so you still have to apply to the army, RAF etc and not a separate body and should stay that way in my opinion.  I would hate it if they turned the likes of GMP, Met Pol etc private as I think some accountability would be lost.

I think there are dangers certainly with private police forces where you could potentially get vigilantism.  I've already seen it with private security firms where the security personel think they are gods cops on earth and that the law doesn't apply to them    Yes you could get that within your local forces as well but I think its less likely due to the regulations in place and media attention it would bring.

I would imagine that there would be significant implications and concerns if the FRS was privatised as a whole as well?  I can't see how that would help the situation as it stands and would seem like change for changes sake?  I do hope this gets sorted out soon for all concerned.

[Midland Retty]

I thought they was already private police forces in the Uk. BTP Transport police paid for by the rail companies Habour police paid for by the habour boards MOD police paid for by the MOD.

As Cat has already stated they aren't "private" police forces as such. They exist due to legislation which specifically requires them to cover a specific area of public safety or crime detection and reduction.

They are acountable to mini police authorities and most if not all are inspected by HM Inspector of Constabulary. There are rules governing how they must be trained, and how they perform. They aren't just a group of people who have donned a uniform and jacket with "police" on the back and automatically think they are police officers.

For the reason Cat sets out I think privatising the emergency services would be very dangerous, profit before service, possible corruption, and a lack of accountability and consistency is what worries me the most. We already have elements of that now, but it would be worse if pushed out to the private sector.

Do we want to see our police, ambos, firefighters, and Coastguards donned in uniforms blazened with sponsors logos? like: "The Metropolitan Fire Brigade: sponsored by Joe Bloggs Supermarkets where baked beans are now only 5p!"

Part of me can't help feel that is the way we are going, and that in 10 years time today's Fire Service, and indeed emergency services will look very different, and not necessarily because of natural progress, or for the best, but because someone will want to truly turn them into corporate businesses rather than public bodies!

[nearlythere]

Private F&R Service? Fantastic idea. Will you lot wake up, smell the coffee and modernise - again.
Between taking calls Controls can take the pizza orders and between fires the lorrys can deliver them.

And what about a slogan for the new Fire & Rescue Company?

"Fires can kill but our pizzas are brill".

[colin todd]

Nearly, I love the idea and the slogan. Can I design the uniform for the control operators.
Anyway, fire and rescue services want to do trading against the private sector, so why not go the whole hog and privatise them. Can I be a chief officer cum pizza baker?

[nearlythere]

Nearly, I love the idea and the slogan. Can I design the uniform for the control operators.
Anyway, fire and rescue services want to do trading against the private sector, so why not go the whole hog and privatise them. Can I be a chief officer cum pizza baker?

Sorry Colin but in the interest of providing a cheap service   value for money I was going to behead my New Fire & Rescue Company and dumb down principal management to a more appropriate and knowledgable level - Station Commander.

As for the post of chief pizza baker you have failed at the first hurdle. I have no idea how to cook a pizza but I have never heard of anybody baking one. I have heard of people making one but never baking. Therefore, consider your application shredded.

I hear KFC are on the look out for chip fryers though.

[AnthonyB]

Strangely private operated public emergency services I've ever seen have needed to carry 3rd party adverts nor provide pizzas!

There is already 3rd party adverts from private companies on existing public emergency services vehicles via sponsorship & partnership working - you would rarely see this on private service vehicles.

I'm not particularly for privatisation though, just that there are some daft arguments against it here - focus on the real potential drawbacks, not the tabloid urban myths.

It's already happened anyway - the non emergency ambulance service has been privatised for years with NHS Ambulance Trusts just being another bidder at tendering time and quite often not winning. The emergency side is sliding that way with a lot of ambulance trusts already using private and voluntary services most of the year to bolster their resources - yet they don't publicise this and make sure the private company vehicles are so similar to the trust ones that only the trained eye can spot the subtle differences (one private company doing 999 work can only be identified as the only difference from normal NHS motors is that they retained one aspect of the company livery - two green reflective diagonal stripes on the bonnet)

[Midland Retty]

Well strangely enough I have Anthony...

Can you point out what the daft arguments are? I think most people have been subjective on this (other than the humerous comments about the pizzas)

[Davo]

God help me folks

Have to admit Toddy's technically correct, the pizza base is baked




davo


slinks away in embarrassment..............

[jokar]

The pot is being stirred a little now.  Evidently whilst both parties have decided to go to the RAP, the Chair has asked Officers whether they now need the 27 pumps removed to provide the contigency arrangements and to report back on their findings.  He always wanted to smash the Brigade and is doing his best to achieve that aim.  I wonder what the Officers will decide.