Extra Care

[Dinnertime Dave]

Looking at a proposed  extra care scheme being built to ADB. Looked through lots of threads on here we have all commented on the lack of guidance. I know Manic has real concerns with these but my question is –

What purpose group do you consider extra care schemes fall into.

Is it 1(a) flats or 2(a) Residential (institutional)

To save you all time reading ADB 2(a) says – Hospital, home, or other similar establishment used as living accommodation for, or for the treatment, care or maintenance of persons suffering from disabilities due to illness or old age or other physical or mental incapacity, or under 5 years, or place of lawful detention where people sleep on the premises.

The RRO guidance says – Use the sleeping accommodation guide for - All premises where the main use is to provide sleeping accommodation, e.g. hotels, guest houses, B&Bs, hostels, residential training centres, holiday accommodationand the common areas of flats, maisonettes, HMOs and sheltered housing (other than those providing care – see Residential care premises), but excluding hospitals, residential care premises, places of custody and single private dwellings.

Or Use [b]Residential care and nursing homes guide for - Common areas of sheltered housing (where care is provided) and similar premises, which are permanently staffed and where the primary use is the provision of care rather than healthcare (see Healthcare premises). 
 
It is also necessary to understand how care is defined, this has been more of a struggle as it appears that it could be many things including “opening letters, putting shoes on, cooking meals, wiping *****. People can be ambulant or bedbound.   

Does it make a difference? Clearly it has implications on travel distances 9m & 18m in residential care or 7.5m & 30m in flats but if a stay put policy is in place does it matter.  It would also make a difference on who would be expected to carry out any evacuation in a fire.

I have a view that it is 2(a) but willing to listen to reason

[William 29]

I would agree with 2(a) if you have to place it in a purpose group. I have dealt with a lot of these and I don't think you can pin them down to any guide as none of them really fit the building types, use and people in them.  Google "fire safety in adult placements" http://www.planningportal.gov.uk/uploads/br/BR_ASSDOC_PTB_Adult.pdf

There is some good common sense in this guide (code of practice) for premises with low numbers of occupants but the general principles are sound in my view and can be adapted to larger premises based on the risk, staff levels, training etc.  These types of premises really are the ones that we have to risk assess based on what guidance is out there and apply a common sense risk based approach.

[Argyle]

As a facility are the residents occupiers of the whole building or do they have a tenancy agreement to their own flat (ie - is their flat their home - or is the building as a whole their home)

[Dinnertime Dave]

Thanks both of you for your replies.
 

As a facility are the residents occupiers of the whole building or do they have a tenancy agreement to their own flat (ie - is their flat their home - or is the building as a whole their home)

The complex is of 4 floors approx 90 flats, cinema, gym, restaurant and communual lounges. I have found out today that the flats can be rented, purchased outright or shared ownership.

I would agree with 2(a) if you have to place it in a purpose group. I have dealt with a lot of these and I don't think you can pin them down to any guide as none of them really fit the building types, use and people in them.  Google "fire safety in adult placements" http://www.planningportal.gov.uk/uploads/br/BR_ASSDOC_PTB_Adult.pdf

There is some good common sense in this guide (code of practice) for premises with low numbers of occupants but the general principles are sound in my view and can be adapted to larger premises based on the risk, staff levels, training etc.  These types of premises really are the ones that we have to risk assess based on what guidance is out there and apply a common sense risk based approach.

 

William - To enable me to carry out my obligations as an I/O I need to place it in relavent purpose group, hence the question.

Also, whilst I am aware of the guidance you refer to personally I don`t think it is the right guide to use in extracare, sheltered housing or most care homes. its use should be restricted to domestic dwellings of up to three storeys (i.e. ground, first and second floors), which are occupied by no more than three service users in addition to the Carer and their own family.

[Argyle]

DD - I take it that at this stage this is a building reg consultation - what purpose group has the building control put on it ?

[Dinnertime Dave]

DD - I take it that at this stage this is a building reg consultation - what purpose group has the building control put on it ?

It has 1(a) on it, apparently this is normal. travel distances in the corridor of 24m

[William 29]

Sorry DTD, you are right the guide I mentioned would not be applicable to the building as you describe it.