Security devices for boundary fences with fire exit gates

[Haggis]

Any suggestions on the following:

I frequently visit schools and one huge safety concern is push pads provided on external gates around the building. To ensure pupils can be evacuated away from the external playground areas emergency pedestrain gates have been provided for emergencies, however security issues arise when some pupils make a run for it during playtimes or during classtime and escape from these areas and onto roads etc, even when additional supervision is provided. Even the young primary pupils can negate push pads and escape therefore a lot of these gates are being locked with padlocks/chains by staff. Redlams, Ashworths or similar devices can't be used as the gates are used daily for pupil drop off/collection

This gives concerns for the local fire officers during audits who say external gates should not be padlocked just incase pupils have to move further away from building in emergencies (regardless of distances of the boundary fences) even though staff will ensure they all carry keys or know the combination of the padlocks.

Just what would be acceptable?
High handle operation in combination with a push pad?
padlocks with combinations?

All suggestions appreciated
HH

[Dinnertime Dave]

This gives concerns for the local fire officers during audits who say external gates should not be padlocked just incase pupils have to move further away from building in emergencies (regardless of distances of the boundary fences) even though staff will ensure they all carry keys or know the combination of the padlocks.

It concerns me that there is a lack of common sense. Clearly if the evacuation point is far enough from the building then both security and fire safety are satisfied. If that does not satisfy the IO then why not put a key in a break glass box next to the fire alarm panel. But logically if you have locked gates and the fire service need to gain access for firefighting they would cut the padlock off.

Sometimes as inspecting officers we become over focused on fire without looking at other issues that are equally important.

[jayjay]

I have had a number of schools fitted with push pads but are fitted at a higher level out of the reach of primary/junior school children. To prevent access from outside of the gates the pad is protected by either enclosing the pad in an open ended metal box enclosure to prevent the pad being operated from the outside or by fitting a steel plate behind the pad large enough to prevent operation from the outside.

The provision of keys is not a great solution as inevitably it will be missing at a critical time. I have known one school that issued every teacher with a key, but on subsequent visits when I have questioned teachers on the location of their key it was often not readily available.

The location of school assembly points can not always be in one area and I have had situations where three assemnbly points were required which is not good for roll calls and evacuation management. School play areas are sometimes separated by fences and gates and access is some times required between these areas to allow further evacuation from the building, the protected key pads can be used in this situation also.

In junior and primary schools where the majority of the pupils will live close to the schools, a fire at the school will very quickly become known to the parents. Imagine the reaction of those parents if a serious fire developed and there was a delay or non aavailable key. 

[Fishy]

So long as the occupants can reach a "Place of safety" (as defined in the Regulations relevant to the location), and they're in a place where they can be managed safely from other risks, then why is there an issue?  From a fire safety point of view you don't necessarily have to get people out on the street - you just have to make them safe from the fire, and if you can do that inside the boundary then I would suggest there's no need for any emergency exit ironmongery on the gates?

[Haggis]

the 3 school play areas are sepaaretd by fences: primary 1-3, ASN base, P4-7. Yes they use separate assembly points due to the location of the school next to a main road; runners and radios are used to confirm roll call. The larger number of pupils have football pitch to the rear of the school where they assemble (which is a suitable distance away), the younger pupils and ASN pupils have smaller fenced areas with only 10 metres distance from the building, so if the fire took hold near their area they would prob need to move further away and hence need to use the gate to egress further away. Highpush pads were considered but some of the ASN pupils could reach them and still escape. They have a tendancy to push things that are signed as 'Push to open'.

The building has a life safety water suppression system fitted, which i argued with the IO on but he was still lecturing on and on about  keys/locks etc.

One of the gates has a mortice lock/key, should this not be used and a padlock/chain used instead?

[kurnal]

you could do this with a combination lock?

[Martin]

I've dealt with this question a number of schools in different authorities. If there is school playing field which is far enough from the buildings to be considered safe even in the event of a catastrophic fire I state this on the assessment and do not ask for a means of entirely leaving the site.

Locking gates to ensure pupils do not make unauthorised exits is more problematic. I know of primary schools in East London with crowded small playgrounds opening onto very busy highways. One actuaully had as a part of business continuity planning arrangements to evacaute to a nearby secondary school.

Ensuring pupils remain on site and preventing intruders in these cases requires fairly high security. Balancing fire risk against safeguarding children is not easy. The good news is the fairly high levels of supervison, particularly in a primary school,  lends itself to a management control system for unlocking gates. The simplest solution I ever saw was for keys to the outside locks to kept on fluorescent lanyards near the building doors which were then picked up by supervisors. Easy visual checking, simple for users and it worked. School reported local FRS happy but I think it was an operational crew on a familiarisation visit not an IO.

 I have seen combination locks but when asking staff on duty for combination I got wrong numbers, no numbers etc. especially if a lock has been in place for some time with change of staff. Eventually someone turned up who knew combination but not really satisfactory.

[Haggis]

Thanks everyone. As i said the main assembly point is a suitable distance away but the two other areas are kind of pend in hence the provision of gates and for pupil drop off/collection during and outwith normal school hours (morning/evenng kids clubs etc). Keys on fobs next to roll call sheets is achievable and will be recored on an assessment to justify the action taken. There just seems to be lots of kids wanting to the do a runner these days! even with supervision.

The risk of person getting trapped in low but as soon as you mention keys and locks on external gates our local enforcement officers seem to get sweaty.

HH