Author Topic: Self-closing devices speeds  (Read 17413 times)

Offline Haggis

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Self-closing devices speeds
« on: December 16, 2015, 12:30:04 PM »
Need some help with interpreting the following:

BSEN1154
5.2.6 Closing time
After 5 000 test cycles and after 500 000 test cycles, the closing time, from a door opening angle of 90?, shall
be capable of adjustment to 3 s or less, and 20 s or more.
After 500 000 test cycles, the closing time set at 5 000 test cycles shall not have increased by more than
100 %, or decreased by more than 30 %.

Does this specify the closing time of a self-closing device should be no more than 3 seconds?

Offline wee brian

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Re: Self-closing devices speeds
« Reply #1 on: December 16, 2015, 02:03:57 PM »
Should, but not must....

Offline Mike Buckley

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Re: Self-closing devices speeds
« Reply #2 on: December 16, 2015, 03:22:27 PM »
Bear in mind that in elderly accomodation the doors need to close slowly to avoid the problem of resditents being fired down the corridor like flippers in a pinball machine.
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Offline wee brian

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Re: Self-closing devices speeds
« Reply #3 on: December 16, 2015, 04:05:22 PM »
Actaully, having read it again/

"3 s or less, and 20 s or more"

Just means that the scale of adjustment should include 3 to 20s. but you could have 1 to 50 and still comply. you can then adjust it on site to a speed suitable for the specific premises.

Offline Haggis

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Re: Self-closing devices speeds
« Reply #4 on: December 16, 2015, 06:09:16 PM »
Thanks. Yes it was concerning the speed of closers in care homes; had a small incident whereby a resident moved a bit quicker through a door set one day!!

Offline wee brian

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Re: Self-closing devices speeds
« Reply #5 on: December 17, 2015, 10:10:15 AM »
There was a case of a resident being killed by a self closing door when the hold open devices had been switched off remotely.

Since then, its best to release them one at a time using the button on the magnet.


Offline col10

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Re: Self-closing devices speeds
« Reply #6 on: December 17, 2015, 12:41:23 PM »
In care homes "fire doors should take account of the needs of residents."  ADB in 3.51 suggests free-swing closers to bedrooms and hold open devices to circulation spaces.
3.52 says closers to bedrooms not needed if a sprinkler system fitted.

Offline SeaBass

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Re: Self-closing devices speeds
« Reply #7 on: December 17, 2015, 01:57:05 PM »
An NHS Estates and Facilities Alert dated Dec 3rd 2015 advised of a recent incident were an elderly patient was knocked to the floor by self closing cross corridor doors that were released during a power failure. The fall resulted in  head injuries that  ultimately contributed to the patients death.

A  risk assessment template for self closing doors was included in the alert and recognises that BE-EN 1154 permits a variation on closing speed of between 3 and 25 seconds. The actual closing speed needs to be based on the likelihood of harm, but in any premises where the frail and elderly may be moving about unescorted, clearly, the slower  the closing motion, the safer the occupants will be.

With regards to the  remote, manual release of self closing  fire doors that are held open; BS 7273:4 states that to avoid risks to people using the door, the remote release device should be within clear vision  of the doors that it release?s. Alternatively where the doors are not clearly visible from the location of the manual release, the manual release device should be clearly labelled, and on activation of the manual release mechanism, an audible warning device should operate in the vicinity of the doors.  That?s what the standard says, but I?ve never seen it in practice.     

Offline kurnal

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Re: Self-closing devices speeds
« Reply #8 on: December 17, 2015, 08:40:24 PM »
One of the worst  things I came across was sprung double swing saloon type hinges on the cross corridor doors on a purpose built care home built in the 1990s. Not only were they extremely violent they rarely  centred properly so  failed on both counts. The sad fact is that despite my pointing out the dangers annually for 10 years the owner has still not replaced them. I used forceful language and an intolerable risk rating pointing out the risk of serious injury or worse should the  fire alarm sound with a vulnerable person in the vicinity but to no avail.The only action he would take was to work on the centreing action .
« Last Edit: December 18, 2015, 12:24:58 PM by kurnal »

Offline colin todd

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Re: Self-closing devices speeds
« Reply #9 on: December 17, 2015, 08:51:26 PM »
Her name was Maude, Wee B.
Colin Todd, C S Todd & Associates

Offline Fishy

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Re: Self-closing devices speeds
« Reply #10 on: December 18, 2015, 07:11:32 AM »
BS EN 1154 is a testing and requirements product standard... hence all the blurb about what it should do when tested.  I don't believe it tells you anything about how you should install/adjust it, nor how quickly it ought to close a particular door.

Offline Tom Sutton

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Re: Self-closing devices speeds
« Reply #11 on: December 18, 2015, 08:49:06 AM »
Agreed Fishy it's the degree of adjustment which means you will be at least able to adjust between -3 to +20 seconds the speed of closing is up to the user.The title of the paragraph is misleading.
All my responses only apply to England and Wales and they are an overview of the subject, hopefully it will point you in the right direction and always treat with caution.

Offline nearlythere

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Re: Self-closing devices speeds
« Reply #12 on: December 18, 2015, 03:53:17 PM »
One of the worst  things I came across was sprung double swing saloon type hinges on the cross corridor doors on a purpose built care home built in the 1990s. Not only were they extremely violent they rarely  centred properly so  failed on both counts. The sad fact is that despite my pointing out the dangers annually for 10 years the owner has still not replaced them. I used forceful language and an intolerable risk rating pointing out the risk of serious injury or worse should the  fire alarm sound with a vulnerable person in the vicinity but to no avail.The only action he would take was to work on the centreing action .
I have also seen such devices K which would level a heavyweight wrestler on release.
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