NEBOSH Fire Safety Qualification

[bravo9/1]

At present I assist our Health & Safety Advisor at work with FRA,s and Fire Awareness Training for staff and such like.Have attended a number of courses including Fire Management and company Fire Risk Assessors Courses for a number of years now.Can anyone help me on the requirements for undertaking a NEBOSH Fire Safety qualification course.

[kurnal]

I teach on NEBOSH  general certificate courses from time to time for a local chamber of commerce.
The NEBOSH general  certificate is a very broad ranging qualification intended to give some all round competence in the general field, and is generally seen as the minimum qualification for a professional h&S practitioner. Unless you want to  focus only on the fire safety aspects I would consider taking this as the first step then taking a fire safety course in addition.

The general course  does not help you very much in terms of the specific area of fire safety. The knowledge on fire - and all other topics- you will gain from the course is fairly shallow. What you will get out of both courses  is a good understanding of the law, the main regulations covering the management of H&S, and in the general course lots of practice in applying the principles of prevention to answer questions of how to approach a  diverse range  situations from trenching to glueing soles on shoes.  Much more useful in the general workplace I wuould suggest.
It will give you a good foundation in  problem solving and gerneral risk assessment and the presentation of reports. It sounds from what you say like it would be a good career move to take the nebosh general course first then a more specialist course later if you want to focus on the fire safety side only.

[bravo9/1]

Thank you very much for your quick reponse.Last year I attended a IOSH course and found it worthwhile as I had been carrying risk & coshh assessments for a number of years for my main role within the company but the Fire Safety was a supporting role which I had been asked to do because I have been a retained firefighter for 20 years

I was kind of hoping that I could attend the NEBOSH Fire Safety course and gain a recognised certificate that may help in my supporting role within the company

Thanks

[kurnal]

Yes of course you can do this and it will be worthwhile- there is no specfic requirement to have any particular qualification to carry out fire risk assessment- its all about a mix of training, qualification and experience. There are three recognised fire risk assessment courses and I believe the Nebosh is one of these.

 I was in a round about way saying you would perhaps be a more useful to the average employer with the nebosh general certificate as you would then be much more versatile-with skills for example in  manual handling, display screen equipment, working at height, coshh, work equipment, permits to work, noise at work, and a whole lot more.

[Ken Taylor]

You will be talking about the NEBOSH Fire Safety and Risk Management Certificate - for which, as Kurnal says, there is no entry qualification. Details, venues, etc are available at:

http://www.nebosh.org.uk/awardsnew.asp?ID=12

This seems very appropriate in your case - and for many health and safety practitioners, managers, etc who are having fire risk assessments added to their duties.

[PhilB]

I have been an instructor on NEBOSH Fire Safety and Risk Management Certificate course and to be perfectly honest it is a very basic course and would not really equip you to risk assess complex premises without further study.

Also the NEBOSH format that you have to use to carry out the practical fire risk assessment poduces a document which, in my opinion is far from suitable and sufficient.

[Ken Taylor]

Interesting, Phil. Presumably you have commented to NEBOSH to this effect.

A problem with competence to carry out FRAs is that one could be dealing with anything from an office to a complex chemical establishment - but then the same problem exists for the H&S practitioner for the various degrees of establishment complexity. For the really complex there is a need to bring in the expert but for many lesser establishments a person trained in the nature, spread, prevention, extinguishment, etc of fire may well have to serve - provided that proper consultation and cooperation takes place with those involved with and understanding the various activities, processes, plant, equipment, etc involved.

Can we conclude that someone in Bravo's position would gain from the NEBOSH FS & RM Cert at least as a starting point or can you recommend a better route for him?

[PhilB]

Yes of course that information was fed back to NEBOSH and I understand they are addressing that problem.

And yes some like Bravo could gain from the course but it is very basic. Many employers are sending their employees on this level of course and then expecting them to become the company expert and risk assess very complex buildings.

Are there other better courses?? in my opinion yes FPA, FSC and even my old friend Collllin Toddddd run courses that go into fire risk assessment in much greater depth.

I am very concerned however with the Fire Service College, they have dessimated the fire safety department and therefore the very few seconded officers left have very little time to develop or improve courses.

[jokar]

The London Fire Brigade have just had theor Fire Risk Assessemnt course accredited by the IFE as the first Fire Brigade and are only the 3rd organisation to have this approval.

[Ken Taylor]

We get this problem with the NEBOSH General Cert too. It's a very basic course in health and safety and employers can send someone on it and then expect them to be the company expert in H&S - instead of employing a Chartered Member of IOSH or someone of that order - but it's still a good starting point for a career in H&S.

[kurnal]

The goalposts move with time. When I did the NEBOSH course it was marketed as the minimum qualification for a competent person. Now the diploma has the same status. Soon it will be a masters degree.
The whole point about the nebosh general cert to me is that it is so broad and wide ranging candidates end the course with an understanding of how little they know about so much.
 
A measure of competence is to understand  your own limitations. This coupled with an understanding of responsibility in law is a good result. I dont think some of the other available basic courses such as IOSH managing safety give anywhere near as good general awareness and practice in problem solving in diverse situations.

Can anybody have full expertise in all areas of occupational  H&S -whether  chartered member of IOSH, CEng or anything else? Personally I dont think so. I believe there will always be a need for the "company expert" to seek advice from a specialist in a particular field- including fire, DSEAR, radiation, biohazards,chemical hazards,noise,asbestos for example.

[Mike Buckley]

I agree with you kurnal, I don't think anyone can have full expertise in all areas. I see the "company expert" very much on the same lines as a GP in the NHS, deal with the simple everyday work. You may have special interests where you have a greater expertise, but know when to call in a specialist.