Need Help to get some information in to solving this problem!!!

[Hunter]

I work for Mark & spencer and i am also a Health & Safety Officer for one of my store. I have only started the job two months. I am hearing impaired person and without my hearing aids on i am completely deaf!!  I am abit concern about most of the stores have not got flashing lights in the customers toilets + disable toilets to warn them of when a fire alarm go off!!! In my store only one person can go in the toilet!!! If the fire alarm go off while the deaf person is in there, that person had no warning about it!!! 1. No point of knocking on doors because they can't hear. 2. U can't put any thing under the doors to let them know that something had happen. 3. we can't open the doors because it could be a woman!!!  

I have recomend that a flashing lights to be put in all the toilets which is usefull for customers with hearing imparied or completely  hard of hearing!!  But they say that it not needed etc..... plus if they have to put it in my store then they would have to put it in all stores!!! I said' well yes of course!!!

Can someone please help me with this!!!!

[kurnal]

It may be better to give the hearing impaired staff a vibrating pager linked to the fire alarm system. They can also give you a text message as well giving the location of the alarm or specific pre-planned instructions. In the short term if you can get hold of a phone with a vibrate function you could team up with a colleague as a buddy to call you with a text.

Have you seen the governmant guidance note no 12- here

http://www.communities.gov.uk/publications/fire/firesafetyassessmentmeans

[Hunter]

This is only for customers that come in and used the toilet. Not for a member of staff!!

[kurnal]

Yes then you are right Hunter if offering a service to the Public  there is a duty under the DDA to make reasonable adjustments to buildings to ensure that all members of society are able to use the service, and that under the Fire Safety Order all customers and staff are "Relevant Persons" and there must be a suitable and sufficient means of raising the alarm of fire and an evacuation plan that works for all. If providing a visual sounder there must also be a sign to explain what it means and what to do if it operates.
Usually such organisations use fire wardens to search areas such as toilets if an evacuation takes place, usually the fire wardens will have a security key giving access to toilet cubicles if locked- however nobody wants to outrage a persons dignity.

[Ashley Wood]

Hunter, the fire risk assessment that was done for your store should have identified your need as a vulnarable person. Worth asking if you can see a copy.

[wee brian]

If it was a new store it would have beacons in the loos. For an exisitng store your FRA would pick up that there werent any and then you would need to decide what to do.

You could make sure that fire wardens check the loos when evacuating the stoe or you could by a few beacons etc.etc.

[Midland Retty]

Yes the fire risk asessment should identify persons with specific "needs" (I don't like using that word) but you know what I mean.

Everyone should be entitled to resort in a public place safely. In the store area (excluding changing rooms the use of beacons could be excluded so long as staff did a sweep.

Changing rooms and loos should have a beacons I would suggest as you shouldnt have a member of staff bursting in on anyone in the changing rooms / loos.

[wee brian]

Here we go again - spending vast sums of money on very small risks - it's disproportionate.

Sure if you are replacing the system or you have concerns about effective procedures then maybe we should upgrade. But you cant keep replacing things every time a code gets updated.

[jasper]

as a person who is registered disabled (if you are) your employer should have undertaken a PEEP personal emergency evacuation plan and introduced measures accordingly - this is as well as the separate assessment for members of the public

[Clevelandfire]

Here we go again - spending vast sums of money on very small risks - it's disproportionate.

Sure if you are replacing the system or you have concerns about effective procedures then maybe we should upgrade. But you cant keep replacing things every time a code gets updated.

I think thats a very sceptical view and to be completely honest I take offence at it. What would be the cost implication for a few beacons in strategic areas? The words 'reasonably practicable' spring to mind. Not alot for someone like M&S really in the greater scheme of things. It's easy to mock perceived politically correct policies but having suffered hearing damage from working in a foundry for 15 years let me tell you that you soon wish health and safety regs were more stringent back then. I have got permanent tinatus and I cant hear certain frequencies, you cant imagine what its like to have good hearing which is then lost. Im not a moaner but what I do strongly object to is being told just because i have a hearing imparment im not as important or entitled to be as safe as able bodied persons or that policies designed to give me equal rights are OTT. As a risk assesor my job is to give my clents safe solutions at a sensible price. I do that and I think I do it well. Whilst code huggers do my head in you should and must do everything reasonably practicable to maintain everyone's safety. By your argument old established hotels shouldn't have AFD installed in them.

[wee brian]

OOps I've ofended somebody - oh well I've got over it.

You think it makes sense to fit strobes in every shop toilet in the country and that this won't cost much.  Do you sell them? Do you only want M&S to do it cos they are loaded??  I'm glad you think you do your job well.

You need to evaluate a risk and deal with it proportionately. Sure sometimes its gonna make sense to stick a few strobes in the bogs but in most cases you can handle it quite adequately with a management procedure.

[redbadge]

Am I being daft or aren't most toilet doors in public or work places fitted with indicator bolts to show whether the "position" is vacant or engaged? Have a look at one from the outside and you'll probably find a slot at the centre of the spindle which is intentionally there to enable the door to be opened from the outside with a coin (or similar).

Management procedure...

Steal a 2p from the till before checking the building is empty!

[Midland Retty]

So are we going to have female staff walk into gents toilets? Are we going to have male staff walk into female loos and wave a sign underneath the cubicle doors. What? Come on boys what do you suggest?

[CivvyFSO]

Do you think that may be embarrassing for the hearing impaired person sat on the toilet?

[redbadge]

Risk Analysis!

Option 1

Male staff interupts male - no risk
Female staff interrupts female - no risk
Male staff interupts female - risk of embarrasment
Female staff interupts male - risk of embarrasment

Option 2

Flashing lights / sirens etc - risk of cost

Option 3

None of the above - risk of death


Shall we take a vote???