PAS 999: The latest

[colin todd]

Oops. PS I always find it odd why people with axes to grind log in as guests and change their name when they wish to make personally critical and childish comments. I mean, Mark old chap, are you a Small Businessman, are you Puzzled or are you just our old friend Mark1london???

[Ken Taylor]

I suspect that you are right, Peter. I wish it was £9 (or even free, sent to all fire and local authorities and made available on the internet). It took years before new legislation was made available free on the internet so I'm not expecting better for British Standards.

[Chris Houston]

Oops. PS I always find it odd why people with axes to grind log in as guests and change their name when they wish to make personally critical and childish comments. I mean, Mark old chap, are you a Small Businessman, are you Puzzled or are you just our old friend Mark1london???

    It is quite wrong for users of this board to post under more than one name.  Anybody found with multiple identities will, in future, be banned.

[dave bev]

chris, does that mean anyone with a split personality aswell??

only joking mate, i know how hard you are trying to sort out a few minor problems!

dave bev

[pd]

Chris,
I say again...why?
If posts are offensive then by all means remove them but Colin can stand up for himself in normal rough and tumble.
Once you go down the route of deciding what is allowed and what isn't, you are taking away half the fun on this board.
anonymous posting is one of the joys of the internet and within certain decency standards should be encouraged. Many of the posters work for the public sector and could not speak so freely if identified. Big brother really is watching you!

[Chris Houston]

Chris,
I say again...why?
If posts are offensive then by all means remove them but Colin can stand up for himself in normal rough and tumble.
Once you go down the route of deciding what is allowed and what isn't, you are taking away half the fun on this board.
anonymous posting is one of the joys of the internet and within certain decency standards should be encouraged. Many of the posters work for the public sector and could not speak so freely if identified. Big brother really is watching you!

Allow me to explain some things:
 - By all means disagree, argue and have opinions on things
 - Remain anonymous if you wish

However:
 - Don't assume multiple identities to try and trick the users of this forum that you are someone different from who you are.  

Sorry if I am ruining peoples fun, because fun is 100% welcome.  I try my best to stay out of interfering with posts as much as I can, but recently a number of postings have warranted action.  You might not agree with my decision, but I am unhappy when people try and trick the other users and, as a moderator I occasionaly have to moderate.

If you want to discuss this further, please email me privately.

Best Regards,

Chris.

[colin todd]

The problem is, Griz, that a person could make supporting comments for himself under different names and claiming to come from different sectors. I mean Mark1london is awfully well informed for what he now claims to be (Small Businessman) on matters about fire safety legislation and the future of the RRO and all sorts of intricate matters pertaining to fire safety legisaltion, so how can he also be so ''Puzzled''. He can surely be just as rude and offensive using his real name.

[psmith@fireassess.co.uk]

Colin,

To go back to the original point.  I too, like other users are having problems in finding this document.  There are almost 100 PAS listings, and when a search for the specific one is done the system gives no results??

Any help on purchasing this document would be useful, although I don't think it will change the way in which I conduct FRA's.  I must admit I do feel there is sufficient guidance out there, although I guess it would take away some of the subjectivity recieved by some inspecting Fire Officers.

P

[colin todd]

Mr Smith, Are you searching the bsi website and can't find the listing?
If you go to www.bsi-global.com/Risk/Fire/pas79.xalter you should find it. Otherwise, if you send me your details under private cover, I can send you a brochure with ordering info. If you are doing fire risk assessments properly, you may be right and you might not change a thing. Equally, you could then probably claim complicance with PAS 79. Hope this helps.

[Paul]

Thanks for this Colin,

The link works just fine.

Ta
P

PS.  my previous thread for some reason listed my username as my email address.  I am not running under a false id.

[steve walker]

Hi all,

Sorry if this is off the original topic but the guidance (or lack of it) for doing risk assessments has been mentioned above.

Where the Fire Brigades inspection officers usually have difficulties is how the significant findings are recorded rather than how the risk assessment was actually carried out. Clearly how it is done is crucial but the enforcers usually only see the findings, so this is what they comment on.

The code of practice for the management of health and safety at work regs does detail three main elements that should be recorded:

1 Details of existing safety measures.
2. Details of any action plan for more safety measures.
3. Evidence that a suitable risk assessment has taken place.

Please correct me if the above is not accurate as it is from memory.

Usually risk assessments include elements 2 and 3 but are very sketchy on 1. Why do you think this is?

Steve

[Ken Taylor]

Your memory is working well, Steve.

[wee brian]

The reason item 1 is often "sketchy" is beacause people don't know what safety measures are there.

Drawing up a plan showing all the measure in place is very time consuming.

[Peter Wilkinson]

PAS79:2005 has just been published on the Barbour Index subscription service, so subscribers can download FOC.

[steve walker]

Yes, it is time consuming and as we know "time is money". But is it necessary? - It must be hard to review the FRA if there is no record of what was considered adequate in the first place. Apart from that, a record will greatly assist staff training and routine maintenaince. The emergency plan, training and maintenaince proceedures can be written but exit routes and physical fire safety equipment are usually best shown on a plan. The dimentions don't have to be exact as long as it shows the relevant features.

Steve