Fire Alarm Standard

[jakespop]

Can anyone enlighten me on standards reqd by BS 5839 Type L1/P1 system. I am dealing with a new build which, whilst not a hospital, has been built to HTM code due to some of the activities carried on there. I am expecting to find total detection coverage as per L1. However I can find no detection in toilet areas. I have queried this as it as an area I would expect to be covered( illicit smooking etc.)
Installer says it complies with L1/P1 and HTM 82 and does not require toliet shower coverage. I am having difficulty finding where it says this. Can anyone assist please?

[Wiz]

BS5839 Part 1 2002 + A2:2008 Clause 8.2 f).

You don't even necessarily need automatic detection in toilet lobbies either.

Toilets are considered low fire risk areas unless there is a real potential for arson. This is considered as being unlikely unless you are talking about somewhere where larger numbers of the public have access to.

The risk of someone starting a fire in a toilet whislt smoking is no greater than elsewhere. The potential for the fire alarm system detecting someone smoking in a toilet is small.

If a fire starts in a toilet it is accepted that the smoke will eventually be detected by detectors in the circulation areas, even if it has had to pass through two doors (if there is a lobby) !!

However, a fire risk assessment may also decide that some toilets need automatic detection.

[jimbosdad]

You could also check out HTM 05-03, part B, 4.6. This gives info on design philospophy for areas where detection may not be needed, as always this will be subject to risk assessment

[FireDave]

The section you are looking for is in HTM 05-03 Pt B as mentioned above.

Below is the relevant Para 4.6 & 4.7

4.6 A Category L2 or L3 system should be provided for healthcare premises other than hospitals.

A category L1 system should be provided throughout all parts of hospital premises.

However, detectors need not normally be provided in the following areas:

voids and roof spaces of any depth which contain only:
(i) MICC or wiring clipped to a metal tray or within metal conduit or trunking;
(ii) non-combustible pipework and ducts;
(iii) metal or plastic pipes used for water supply or drainage;

bath/shower rooms;
toilets in staff areas;
small cupboards (less than 1 m2);
operating theatres.
In any case the omission of detectors should be subject to a risk assessment.


4.7 Detectors should only be omitted from other areas on the basis of an assessment of fire risk.
However, the following areas should always be protected:
all patient access areas;
fire hazard rooms and areas;
rooms or departments below patient access
areas from which fire can spread vertically to
affect patient access areas;
hazard departments;
stairways, lobbies, and corridors used as means of escape where not in frequent use;
patient hotels;
commercial enterprises;
atria;
mechanical and electrical services plantrooms
(other than water tank rooms);
toilets intended for use by the public.

4.8 Omission of detectors from any area should be the
subject of consultation (see paragraph 1.16).


 Para 1.16 states who the consultations should be with.

You should note the last line in para 4.7 as this is new for HTM 05-03 PT B