Register of Fire Risk Assessors & Auditors

[alfi]

Hi Piglet

Yes of course, i'm currently on the IFSM register and have been for many years, this will be disbanded end of 2013 and they are encouraging us to go over the warrington scheme, so i just wanted to find out what other registers were out there and what the majority of assessors on the forum belonged to, if any?. my chain of thought so far  (no disrespect to any scheme so please folks don't shoot me down) is that why when  I have two lots formal qualifications including the FPA european diploma, various IFE accredited courses etc, and have 10 years experience which has never been questioned do i have to then sit a written paper and formal interview,surely like other professional bodies previous qualifications, experience and genuine references should go a long way to showing someones competance, even spend the day on a job.

[Golden]

I've voted for the IFE register as I'm an IFE member and believe it is a truly impartial third party in this case. My reason for applying for the register is to back up my formal qualifications and experience with a third party endorsement and use it as a source of work into my business which I would like to eventually expand, for this reason I shall also be keeping a close eye on the UKAS/BAFE accredited registers and may even go for the FRACS register as well if I have the time.

I don't believe the government will step into making any requirements as its not high profile enough - the only instance where they may get involved is if there is a high profile case and someone will jump up to close the stable door.

[Tom W]

Hi Piglet

Yes of course, i'm currently on the IFSM register and have been for many years, this will be disbanded end of 2013 and they are encouraging us to go over the warrington scheme, so i just wanted to find out what other registers were out there and what the majority of assessors on the forum belonged to, if any?. my chain of thought so far  (no disrespect to any scheme so please folks don't shoot me down) is that why when  I have two lots formal qualifications including the FPA european diploma, various IFE accredited courses etc, and have 10 years experience which has never been questioned do i have to then sit a written paper and formal interview,surely like other professional bodies previous qualifications, experience and genuine references should go a long way to showing someones competance, even spend the day on a job.

Thanks for explaining, you obviously are an ideal candidate to sit and pass any of the accreditation schemes. Its just weighing up the financial benefit. It would no doubt be good to have an institutions stamp on your work but there is a cost that goes a long with that.

Its worthwhile keeping an eye on what the big players do, the chubbs etc as 3rd party schemes will really only work if adopted by the masses and they are the masses. It will work when everyone knows what to look for in an assessor, the marketing reach of the big companies can do that, the likes of Warrington etc cannot. Marketing is a poweful thing and currently the only people I see being marketed about the schemes are the fire trade.

[kurnal]

Golden Can I ask if you see the IFE register as a useful marketing tool for your services?

I have never had a single lead from the IFSM register, not that I looking for leads but I would be interested in a comparison.

[alfi]

I've never had a lead from the IFSM either Kurnel, I'm on the list of consultants on the IFE (not the fire risk asssors list)and had plenty through them, always a lead via the local fire authoirty telling peole to look at the IFE, in fact recently i had a large local authority job via the IFE consultants list and got a glowing letter from there management once i completed, it said what a pleasure it was to work with such a helpful and knowlegable company

[Golden]

Kurnal I'm not on the register yet as I'm only in the process of applying having taken some time mulling over the options. A friend whom I often work with has been on the list a few months and he finds it very productive.

How can the BAFE scheme attract votes when we're not sure what it is yet?

[William 29]

Piglet/Eli can we cut the crap and stick to the issue and fire safety?

[Tom W]

Couldn't agree more, I was just stating my experience with the scheme and why I stopped.

[Eli]

Just trying to get the facts correct; piglet still isn't factually correct nor is he explaining some very important detail; but 'Hey Ho' back to the debate!

I am not a salesman for anyone let alone Warrington; just to set the record straight.

The reality is that people need to be confident in their choice; to certificate or not, accredited scheme or not, company or individual. 

That confidence is not there yet! I absolutely understand that, but since the issue of the competence standard more confidence is growing and when the accompanying RP guidance document is released that will again provide more confidence. I believe there needs to be one more change/initiative within the industry to really push through an improvement and marginalise the cowboys; which I think is what we all want. There are always going to be those that don’t want or need third party but as long as those people exist and are trading the incompetent can trade under their ‘shield of defiance’ (not sure what else to call it)

i.e. if the good don’t take a lead and set the bench mark the bad and ugly don’t need to follow. It happens in all forms of business, once a big player sets off and leads the way many more will follow. Hopefully with the Bafe scheme coming out soon it will stimulate one or two of the major players to start shouting about what they have and there will be a rush to follow.

[nearlythere]

There are always going to be those that don’t want or need third party but as long as those people exist and are trading the incompetent can trade under their ‘shield of defiance’ (not sure what else to call it)

I have another name for "shield of defiance". It's "I don't need it".
Is it OK with the accreditation industry if I can just exist without having to buy in to their wishes?

I have a question about accreditation anyway. Does anyone know how many have been deregistered, removed from or whatever else is done to someone who fails to maintain the standard?

[Tom W]

There really aren't many facts to recall, we went through it, we gave it a go for year and when your next bill came through we judged it on its worth and stopped it. Simple really. Im not sure where the important detail part is.

[Eli]

Piglet My recollections don’t match yours; let’s just move on!

NT you are correct you don’t need it! Therefore no one else does either; so the debate that has been going for the last 4 or 5 years on competence of fire risk assessors is irrelevant. Everyone should accept the open market and stop bleating about crap assessors.

[colin todd]

A little update.  The IFE Register has far more risk assessors on it than any other register, which may be why fire officers refer people to it.  From what I understand from people on the list, it brings in lots of leads.  The IFE Register will not close, and there is absolutely no intention of it going down the IFSM route with Warrington.

The BAFE SP 205 scheme has been published, and it is no secret that it will soon be available from NSI once they are geared up, ready and UKAS accredited.  There is at least one other CB very interested in running it.  The BAFE scheme is a very good scheme, particularly for the small companies and one man bands. It is likely to be quite economic, though larger practices such as ourselves will end up with higher costs than the very small ones.

I enjoy all the in-fighting between Piglet, who works for Dorgard and is entirely open about the fact, and Eli, who apparently is not a salesman for Warrington. It is far more entertaining than all this fire safety malarky.

[alfi]

Thats good news about the IFE, i think if its staying open that will be the route for me, as the IFSM register has two years left it will allow me time to transfer over as theres no rush it doesn't matter how long the prcess is.thanks for all the advice guys its been a good debate

[nearlythere]

We might not need to go down the line of accreditation so much if we could control those churning out Fire Safety experts with monotonous regularity.

I have been referred a fire risk assessment for a three storey place of treatment following an inspection by a regulatory body. This was carried out by such a  person  who has successfully completed one of these courses in a matter of days.
It is one of those Assessments where there are a few extinguishers - dry powders, a front and back door, a stairway, no fire doors and domestic smoke detectors here and there and, taking all of this into consideration, the place is fine.

I thought it took years of experience for someone to be competent enough to be let loose with a clipboard and measuring tape.

I wonder is it made clear to those undertaking the course that they will not become fire safety experts by the end of the week, even when, not if, awarded a completion certificate?

Perhaps we could make good progress by stopping this creation of the overnight fire safety expert. Some poor AP or RP is going to fall some day because of it.