Provision of illuminated exit signs

[kurnal]

We have come across a couple of workplaces (an office and a factory) recently where all exits have been provided with new, maintained, internally illuminated exit signs. In both cases the installers were adamant that they had just attended training courses and that was the rules, all final exits have to have maintained, internally illuminated exit signs.

Well of course we know BS5266-1 provides for an element of judgement - members of the public present, licensed premises, subdued lighting etc but I was wondering if the training providers are also adding some interpretation from BS5499 - ie that externally illuminated signs should be illuminated by a lighting level of at least 5lx under mains failure conditions? And this is probably impracticable taking into account other factors such as consistency of lighting levels etc. Interesting though that the installers did not think it necessary to internally illuminate other safety signs, which is what BS5499 implies.

Anyone recently done a course or providing training able to cast some light on this? (maintained of course)

[lancsfirepro]

Haven't been on an e-light course as such, just an FIA update to the latest e-light standard.  The issues you raise are covered in 5266-1 without referring to 5499.  The latest e-light standard requires the risk assessor to specify what other safety signs should be illuminated (5.4.3), but then quite clearly states what the installer should be illuminating in 6.6.1. (below)

Emergency lighting should be provided in escape routes, open areas, high risk task areas, and points of emphasis including:
a) at each exit door intended to be used in an emergency;
b) near (see Note) stairs so that each flight of stairs receives direct light;
c) near (see Note) any other change in level;
d) mandatory emergency exits and safety signs;
e) at each change of direction;
f) at each intersection of corridors;
g) near to each final exit and outside the building to a place of safety;
h) near (see Note) each first aid post;
i) near (see Note) each piece of fire fighting equipment and call point.
NOTE For the purpose of this subclause, “near” is normally considered to be within 2 m measured horizontally.
Additional emergency lighting should be provided at the locations described in 6.6.2 to 6.6.7. The risk assessor should also take into account any other areas that might represent hazards in the event of a supply failure; typical areas and lighting levels are detailed in Clause 9.

[AnthonyB]

Doesn't mean it has to be an exit box as long as you have a light fitting near enough,usually within 2m.

Did they (as they should be) put the new ISO pictograms on the lights or did they use the defunct EC symbol?

At Firex today I found that Everlux have brought out a range of replacement adhesive overlays to fit most sizes of exit box (from 8W bulkhead, to the metal box and the hanging glazed panel ones) that are transparent when the light is on but also glow in the dark should it fail, seems a nice cheap way of making illuminated and non illuminated signs matching across a site.

[kurnal]

Thanks to both I have always in the past applied the 2m rule of thumb but want to know if engineers are being taught something else. Or if the trainer is giving them duff gen?

I suppose the crux is whether the level of illuminance provided by siting a sign within two metres of a fitting (size not specified) is in any way comparable to the 5lx illuminance specified in both BS5266-1:2011 (clause 5.4.2) and BS5499-4: 2000 (clause 5.2)?

[Midland Retty]

Do the final doors in question have any panic bars / pads or security devices?

If they do I wonder if the installers / training provider misinterpreted the recommendations of  D9, annex D of BS5266 ?

[kurnal]

No we spoke to both companies and they were both adamant that they were instructed as follows- All final fire exits must have maintained illuminated exit signs. period. No ifs or buts or exceptions. I will try and find out who provided the training and follow it up with them.

[Phoenix]

Either the trainers gave out wrong information or the trainees heard it wrong.  Either way, it's wrong - as you already know.  There is no part of fire safety that is not stuffed full of ifs, buts and exceptions.

Stu

[nearlythere]

No we spoke to both companies and they were both adamant that they were instructed as follows- All final fire exits must have maintained illuminated exit signs. period. No ifs or buts or exceptions. I will try and find out who provided the training and follow it up with them.

Who provided the training and who gave the instructions that illuminated signs had to be used? Are the trainers getting confused with the need for signs to be illuminated even if only neccessarily by daylight?

[lancsfirepro]

Doesn't mean it has to be an exit box as long as you have a light fitting near enough,usually within 2m.

Nowhere did I say it had to be an exit box and and nowhere in the opening post did it say there was additional e-lighting within 2m.  I merely provided the info from the standard for the benefit of those that don't have it.

[lyledunn]

5266-8 (4.2) has a note to it; NOTE Maintained exit signs should be considered for applications where occupants may be unfamiliar with the building.
I would say most buildings would have folk in them from time to time who would be unfamiliar. Now I know that this does not answer the OPs query but I guess that these little notes often take on a meaning that perhaps was not entirely intended. Thus it may have been ok for the trainer to make a lose suggestion that the general requirement would be for maintained units. Then again, as Stu says, perhaps not!

Lyle Dunn