Author Topic: P50 Fire extinguishers  (Read 30741 times)

Offline jokar

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P50 Fire extinguishers
« on: January 14, 2014, 08:06:03 AM »
Hi, 
 has anyone any information on the above extinguisher?  I believe they have a 15 year lifespan but have no labels on them; they are either foam or dry powder.

Offline Tom Sutton

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Re: P50 Fire extinguishers
« Reply #1 on: January 14, 2014, 10:16:09 AM »
All my responses only apply to England and Wales and they are an overview of the subject, hopefully it will point you in the right direction and always treat with caution.

Offline AnthonyB

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Re: P50 Fire extinguishers
« Reply #2 on: January 14, 2014, 10:06:42 PM »
They have a 20 year life with extended service at 10 years

They do:
- a 6 litre foam which they are going down the Euro route of marking it specifically suitable for direct use on electrical equipment, and are understood to be considering trying for a Class F rating in the future
- a 6 kilo ABC Powder
- a 4 kilo Super BC Powder (poor man's Monnex!)

Manufacturers site http://www.britannia-fire.co.uk/product/britannia-p50
Manufacturers brochure: http://www.britannia-fire.co.uk/images/pdf/brochures/Britannia%20A4%202012_single_lr.pdf


There is a lot of discussion about this in LinkedIn, some healthy, some not so as there are two individuals who hate anyone who doesn't automatically dismiss it out of hand as 'illegal'

A big upset is that it doesn't 'fit' with BS5306-3 or BS5306-8 (although neither did the very first Wet Chemicals) and not unreasonably that many users may simply 'fit & forget'.  There are fair arguments on each side and only time will tell.

Anthony Buck
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Offline Golden

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Re: P50 Fire extinguishers
« Reply #3 on: February 13, 2015, 01:00:17 PM »
While browsing on another issue I found that 'Blue Watch' the subsidiary of the Chief Fire Officers Association is selling the P50 via their website and SafeLincs - could this be considered an endorsement? Has anybody any news as to whether or not the P50 is being discussed in any 5306 committees as I'm still a bit reluctant to recommend this before any update on this.

http://www.bluewatchshop.co.uk/fire-extinguishers/

Offline Messy

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Re: P50 Fire extinguishers
« Reply #4 on: February 13, 2015, 05:08:17 PM »
We have just bought four P50 foam extinguishers as a trial in very remote, low risk and rarely occupied sites where servicing is expensive and disruptive.

It is intended to test one unit after two years, and another after three to see how they fair before we adopt them as policy on smaller sites. OK, not the most scientific approach, but it might be useful data when risk assessing this change

Offline Dinnertime Dave

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Re: P50 Fire extinguishers
« Reply #5 on: March 02, 2015, 04:44:17 PM »
Looking at the online information, it says that an annual inspection by trained personnel or an appointed distributor (giving third party qualification) is necessary.

If this is the case I cant see where the financial saving come from.  
 

Offline AnthonyB

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Re: P50 Fire extinguishers
« Reply #6 on: March 02, 2015, 09:56:12 PM »
One of the distributors pushing this range includes training the user to do the annual user check during commissioning as part of the purchase fee to overcome this statement.

The manufacturer's intent was always for the user or their representative to do the annual check as oppose to a fire protection company.
Anthony Buck
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Offline lancsfirepro

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Re: P50 Fire extinguishers
« Reply #7 on: March 14, 2015, 04:27:24 PM »
Not this old chestnut again. ::)  The P50 is basically a plastic extinguisher (yes kevlar is a plastic) with 2 gauges...big deal.  Does that really mean it need not be inspected by someone competent?  Nonsense. 
If I was risk assessing a site where P50's were installed and the user wasn't having them maintained by a competent person, it'd be a cold day in Hell before I didn't raise it as an issue.

Offline kurnal

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Re: P50 Fire extinguishers
« Reply #8 on: June 17, 2016, 12:07:54 PM »
The arguments over P50 and trading by fire services continues unabated , as this press release from IFEDA yesterday reveals:
 
 
IFEDA condemns article which it considers has dangerous implications
 
The Independent Fire Engineering & Distributors Association (IFEDA) a trade association representing quality approved and individually owed fire safety companies across the UK has strongly condemned an article which has recently been published by the Fire Industry Association (FIA), and fears public safety could be put at risk.
 
The article which appears in the FIA?s latest newsletter and on their website promotes both the dangerous possibility of non-maintained fire extinguishers, and the widely condemned practice of publically funded fire brigades operating arm?s length trading companies.
 
Graham Ferris General Manager of IFEDA commented: ?I cannot believe that after so many years of hard work in bringing about improvement to the quality standards of fire safety maintenance that any organisation would be as irresponsible as to endorse this type of cavalier approach. All major and trusted institutions within the UK including British Standards, Lloyds, BAFE, BRE and all leading insurance companies, have not only endorsed but also insisted on fire protection equipment receiving annual maintenance from a competent person.?
 
The article also highlights and gives support to the practice of some fire brigades trading with arm?s length companies supplying both fire safety products and services directly to end-users. As brigades are the publically funded bodies bestowed with enormous powers of enforcement under fire safety laws, IFEDA considers this practice not only as unfair competition but also believes that it raises serious ethical questions.
 
Colin Payne, IFEDA National Chairman, did not hide his anger when he stated: ?The practice of publically funded fire brigades competing against private companies is just wrong. The majority of these private companies are run by people who have worked long and hard to establish quality approved services to their customers. They have paid their taxes and business rates and it?s a real kick in the teeth to now find the organisations to whom part of their tax money has gone are now actually competing against them, this cannot be right.?
 
Payne went on to add: ?The recent article contains not only technically incorrect claims; it is also in my estimation morally wrong. To give support to fire brigade trading is indefensible, they cannot be both gamekeeper and poacher.?
 
IFEDA urges all companies involved in the fire protection industry within the United Kingdom to make their feelings known to the publishers of the article.
 
IFEDA believe it is important to have a united body fighting and representing the needs of the fire safety industry, protecting customers, and end users of fire safety equipment.
 
IFEDA can contacted on: 0844 225 1800, email: info@ifeda.org or visit: www.ifeda.org.

The FIA article referred to is available here:

 http://www.fia.uk.com/news/fire-service-to-sell-revolutionary-self-maintained-extinguisher.html
 
 
« Last Edit: June 17, 2016, 12:12:16 PM by kurnal »

Offline Bruce89

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Re: P50 Fire extinguishers
« Reply #9 on: June 21, 2016, 09:16:47 PM »
Best you check out Essex Fire Services web site.

Offline kurnal

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Re: P50 Fire extinguishers
« Reply #10 on: June 21, 2016, 10:06:11 PM »
Hi Bruce do you mean this one? Is there any particular  aspect you wish to refer to?

http://www.essex-fire.gov.uk/news/Service_signs_deal_to_sell_fire_extinguishers/

As an interested bystander it's interesting to note that commercial sales are to be directed to someone with an Essex fire email address, I thought this was supposed to be an arms length trading relationship?

Offline Bruce89

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Re: P50 Fire extinguishers
« Reply #11 on: June 22, 2016, 09:00:12 PM »
Yes Kurnal that's the one, sits uncomfortably with me being an enforcing authority selling these products, it was always the case that when an I.O. Was asked for advice no particular company etc. would be given.
As for the arms length issue clearly some "arms lengths" are not as long as they should be me thinks.

Offline kurnal

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Re: P50 Fire extinguishers
« Reply #12 on: June 22, 2016, 09:53:26 PM »
Yes I had an issue with them when their trading arm  tried to pinch one of my training customers up in Yorkshire. Their sales pitch was that they were part of the fire brigade (without mentioning which) and any profits were ploughed back into community initiatives (without mentioning which community).

Offline Bruce89

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Re: P50 Fire extinguishers
« Reply #13 on: September 28, 2016, 06:45:40 PM »
It gets better (worse I should say) they are now trying to contact hospitals in the county and offer advice from the supplier of the extinguishers that they are now selling. I'm sure plenty of risk assessors on this site would love to be recommended to RP's by their local fire service.

Offline lancsfirepro

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Re: P50 Fire extinguishers
« Reply #14 on: March 08, 2017, 03:19:00 PM »
I see the draft of BS5306-3 has proposed removing the restriction on classing plastic bodied extinguishers as beyond the scope of the standard.  This then makes an allowance for these 'non-metal' (i.e. plastic) extinguishers.  Unfortunately the servicing procedures detailed in the standard cannot be performed on these extinguishers because the pressure retaining cylinder cannot be inspected because it has a cover.  So my response to the draft has been that they should not be serviceable under the standard.