Inconsistency/Interpretation fire safety

[Tom Sutton]

A recent question from Joe Public,

Hi there, I wonder if you could help me. I live in a purpose built block of 10 flats, 6 of which share the same door and stairwell. I arranged a fire risk assessment for the communal area by a recommended company but as soon as the guy arrived he didn't know why he was here! He explained it's very unusual to get them done in blocks of flats it's mainly for office blocks and schools etc.

He did the assessment anyway but recommended we don't need it again! A quick Internet search tells me otherwise and I'm now very confused!!

[kurnal]

Assuming the premises are in England / Wales you should advise Joe to appoint a competent assessor next time. I would look very carefully at the findings and / or ask for my money back.

[SeaBass]

I wouldn't even attempt to defend risk assessors missing aspects of the built or installed fire safety systems. That is clearly lack of attention to detail.  But missing information on any aspect of the soft systems that are in place is a different matter.  Much of this information has to be provided by someone on site. Lots of buildings that are under the control of a managing agent,  don't have anyone on site.  Where there are people on site then their understanding and knowledge of the managed systems and arrangements is what the Assessor has to base their report on.   Surely,  if the assessor was unable to obtain evidence of training,  maintenance, servicing,  and procedures, then so long as  significant findings and an appropriate actions were recorded, then the FRA is suitable and sufficient. Isn't it?   

[AnthonyB]

Should be - I give up to a months notice of what I need to see, both physically and on paper, by including a check list when booking the site visit so that even if unstaffed the agent has time to get the information and access arranged.

If they don't then it gets noted as significant finding and/or limitation, e.g. no fire alarm servicing or testing info = action to carry it out as no evidence of a system of Maintenance under Art.17 was available at the time of visit, usually accompanied with a recommendation to operate a system where evidence of maintenance can be collated, with the advent of e-logbooks it shouldn't be difficult even on unstaffed sites with nowhere for a paper log book.

[Dinnertime Dave]

Just to pick up on Ruby's point about some info not being available. In my post I mentioned that one assessor gave dates of mains electricity periodic test one said not known. The one who gave the date also inserted a photograph of the mains board showing a label with the date on.

Ruby you are also right when you say that the missing information doesn't make the assessment not suitable ans sufficient the action plan does state that the company should ensure that it is maintained in accordance with........

But they both met the same person on site. I think my main point is some people need to try harder.

[The Colonel]

Cardiff

Don't get to hung up on how a company answers the phone, I know of at least two that undertake both fire and asbestos surveys. One company has 95% of their fire risk assessors on the IFE register and the company is BAFE accredited. The two assessments never mix.

[idlefire]

A recent question from Joe Public,

Hi there, I wonder if you could help me. I live in a purpose built block of 10 flats, 6 of which share the same door and stairwell. I arranged a fire risk assessment for the communal area by a recommended company but as soon as the guy arrived he didn't know why he was here! He explained it's very unusual to get them done in blocks of flats it's mainly for office blocks and schools etc.

He did the assessment anyway but recommended we don't need it again! A quick Internet search tells me otherwise and I'm now very confused!!

Perhaps the Fire Risk Assessor in question was trying to explain that it is only a requirement of the FSO (Article 11(2)(c)) to record significant findings if the responsible person employs 5 or more employees, a licence is in force in relation to the premises, or an Alterations Notice requires it.  He might have considered some fire risk assessors unscrupulous for wanting to take money for doing unnecessary written FRAs each year every year. #justsaying

[kurnal]

Well it looks like he failed in basic communication skills if thats the case!

[JT]

Cardiff

Don't get to hung up on how a company answers the phone, I know of at least two that undertake both fire and asbestos surveys. One company has 95% of their fire risk assessors on the IFE register and the company is BAFE accredited. The two assessments never mix.

They can answer the phone however they like - but the fra was awful.
I havent personally seen a jack of all provide a suitable fra yet.