FireNet Community
FIRE SERVICE AND GENERAL FIRE SAFETY TOPICS => Operational => Topic started by: Tom W on February 08, 2013, 10:40:14 AM
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PA
All 46 fire and rescue services in England could be sold off to private firms under secret Government plans.
Local government minister Brandon Lewis calls for new laws that “would enable fire and rescue authorities in England to contract out their full range of services to a suitable provider” in a letter obtained by the Mirror.
He continues: “I appreciate that the proposals are not without controversy; however these changes will help remove barriers and to increase choices that fire and rescue authorities have to contract out their services.”
Labour last night hit out at the proposal. MP John Healey said: “This is a privatisation too far.
"Fire and rescue is an essential public service which we all depend on for our safety, and our lives.
"Firefighting is a no-go area for privatisation. The first and last concern of our fire services must be public protection not company profit.”
The Government is already considering handing over Cleveland Fire and Rescue service to a mutually-run company.
In the letter sent last month to the Regulatory Reform committee, which looks at planned legislation, Mr Lewis says authorities could be handed to a private firm or, as in Cleveland’s case, a “public service mutual.”
He adds: “Fire and Rescue authorities should be able to adopt alternative models for the delivery, under contract, for some or all of their services.
"Certain provisions in existing legislation preclude some services from being delivered by alternative providers.”
England’s 28,245 firefighters could end up with weaker pension and employment rights should the changes be rubber-stamped.
Mr Lewis announced in December the £20million sale of the Fire Service College to the private sector, with Capita named as preferred bidder.
Mr Healey added: “Ministers are already selling the national college to Capita. Now they are opening the door to wholesale privatisation of fire services. The Olympics security fiasco showed private firms often cost more and deliver less than promised when they take over public services.”
Matt Wrack, General Secretary of the Fire Brigades Union, said last night: “This is staggering and outrageous.
"It will put lives at risk as emergency services are run on a whim as private companies and their need for profit will come first.
“We have seen how the public lose out in other privatisations, such as rail, but for emergency services it is even more grotesque as we are there to save lives and property.”
The Fire Officers Association also voiced alarm.
A spokesman said: “Staff are extremely concerned it would not only lead to worse terms and conditions but prove to be the stepping stone towards the eventual privatisation of an essential emergency service.”
A Department for Communities and Local Government spokesman said: “We are keen to work with local authorities and staff to explore the scope for employee-led mutuals where there is local support and backing.”
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Piggers, if I become a chief officer of one of the new private fire brigades, do you want to be Deputy?
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It depends, do I get shiny buttons and get to double declutch to my hearts content?
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No chance and No!
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Shiny buttons take too much work to keep clean and in my fire and rescue service there will be synchromesh so you dont need to worry about double declutching. Should we ofer kelsall a job as our PR man in view of his excellent skills in engaging in marketing?
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Sir Col,
I would like to join your Brigade. I'd love to be Assistant Chief Fire Officer with responsibility for Fire Safety, but I recognise my knowledge base isn't sufficient and I'm aiming too high.
So could I be a Divisional Commander (Head of Staplers, Paper Clips, and Other Office Consumables) instead?.
Would you offer a decent pakage? ie; company fire engine, healthcare cover, posh uniform,and generous pension?
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Sir Col,
I would like to join your Brigade. I'd love to be Assistant Chief Fire Officer with responsibility for Fire Safety, but I recognise my knowledge base isn't sufficient and I'm aiming too high.
So could I be a Divisional Commander (Head of Staplers, Paper Clips, and Other Office Consumables) instead?.
Would you offer a decent pakage? ie; company fire engine, healthcare cover, posh uniform,and generous pension?
Thing is - who's going to put the fires out or will it just be a Service without purpose?
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Oh come on Nearlythere don't start throwing technical considerations into the mix. Why can't people just sit at a desk and look pretty? Whats all this fighting fires malarki? Just confuses the issue :P
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They dont go much to fires in England nowadays unless you can assure them that there are flames issuing from every window, in which case Retters will be able to see the fire from his home in Bordesley Green ( a place to which he always hints I will be invited but it never seems to happen). He can direct operations from there.
Which brigade will be buy first, Retters, London or West Mids. We might as well think big.
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I knew Colin always wanted to be firefighter.
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Thing is - who's going to put the fires out or will it just be a Service without purpose?
It will not be a Service without a purpose. I'm sure we can write a Mission Statement that doesn't cause too much inconvenience with actual fire-fighting.
For example, we will work with community partners to reduce risk. We can visit all the local chip shops and check their fryers are at the right temperature (chips light golden brown and crispy). We will engage with local people on fire safety awareness. We will sit in M&S Cafe and hand out leaflets. We will develop best practice and share knowledge. We will visit a number of other areas and see what the fire risks are in, for example, palm trees and casinos.
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JJ, I never wanted to be a firefighter, thats a scurrilous accusation. I see myself more as a Chief Fire Officer, working out the MPG of fire engines, closing fire stations, presiding over the oppression of the innocent, wasting money on lawyers and QCs in the hope of winning determinations that are non-starters and hob knobbing with members of the fire authority over a civilised glass of wine. How difficult can that be?
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JJ, I never wanted to be a firefighter, thats a scurrilous accusation. I see myself more as a Chief Fire Officer, working out the MPG of fire engines, closing fire stations, presiding over the oppression of the innocent, wasting money on lawyers and QCs in the hope of winning determinations that are non-starters and hob knobbing with members of the fire authority over a civilised glass of wine. How difficult can that be?
Oooo you are funny Colin ;D ;)
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Which brigade will be buy first, Retters, London or West Mids. We might as well think big.
Lets go for London, Uncle Col, I'm sick of Bordesley Green. Yes London with its excellent theatres, restaurants, shops, 24 hour Talisker bars, will also be handy to pop over to 'Call Me Dave's' place for a chat, and of course Sir Kens retirement bash.
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Give me Bordesley Green any time.
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Wait though , did you say 24 hour Talisker bars??????
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I did ;)
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Be careful of the punctuation - this is the Banter Bar 'Limited Edition' Talisker and its made in 24 hours from start to finish using one of matron's special recipes.
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Colin,
I am sorry but you are just not suitably qualilified for this job.
1) You didn't go to school at Eton (or maybe Harrow) and you did not go to either Cambridge or Oxford with Dave and pals.
2) You do not live in Chipping Norton and throw parties for Beccy and Dave etc.
3) Your skill at running a company,now Colin unless you have run a really big company and have succeeded in tipping the world into a major economic recession or failed totally to fulfil a major contract such as supplying security for the Olympic Games, you just obviously do not have the right stuff. At least you could have claimed expenses for cleaning the moat and providing 5 star houses for the ducks in your neice's (hem hem)house which is 300 miles away from your place of work.
4)Finally your previous experience, come, come they want a fresh view on the fire brigade and if you have any experience of fire service operations greater than watching Fireman Sam or Camberwick Green you are obviously biased.
You will of course be able to appeal against any decision and your appeal should be accompanied by suitable documentation in large denomination used notes to be delivered to an address in black plastic bags.
Sorry Colin you just haven't got it
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Ok Retters, you have persuaded me. LFB is what we buy. Is there one of them there 24 hour Talisker bars within easy striking distance of Union Street? Do we have to TUPE anyone from the existing (or do I mean exiting) senior management? These are details we need to know before we make an offer (but not necessarily in that order). Nevertheless, put the gaffe at Bordersley Green on the market-you know the one you always say I can visit but always welsh on the offer-in anticipation in a future move to Peckham Rye.
Michael: Dave and his cronies, will be fascinated by Retters and his funny west mids accent. They wont know what he is saying and will just nod when he says " Dow yow wanna zell me a foyer brigggoide".
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How very dare you - I don't speak that posh Col!
Anyway sorry for delay in replying - I was busy selling my gaff. I'm renting a caravan next to the Cadbury's factory in Bournville for now.
In answer to your questions...Yes and yes (although I have a contact in Sarrttthhh Landannn called "Knuckles" - he is very effective at dealing with "employee relationship resolution" issues )
Now then in preparation of purchasing LFB I'm busy learning cockney and I've read "Janet and John Learn How to double de-clutch a fire engine" from cover to cover. I've also been watching lots of re-runs of London's Burning and Minder to get used to the lingo and culture. "Give him a slap, Terry" is apparently a term of endearment in London
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Park the caravan in Union Street, Retters, the HQ will soon be ours.
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You pair seem to have forgotten something. There might be an odd fire or two to put out. Not unless you plan to buy up the non fire section of the Fire Brigade. Anyway the end users are bloody pests. If it wasn't for them you could both run a great UK fire service.
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You pair seem to have forgotten something. There might be an odd fire or two to put out.
We'll contract that out and get people on JSA to do it.
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Almosthere: We will be reopening fire stations left right and centre, because we are bringing back fire marks and charging a fortune for each fire we attend AND we will go to false alarms, cos we want to keep the brothers and sisters in jobs, not like some of the miseryguts in the public fire and rescue services. It worked in Kurnal's day. When I say "we" obviously I dont mean Retters and I. Any time control calls, Retters will tell them to call back if it gets to 50 pumps and then pour me another shot of Talisker at the 24 hour Talisker bar.
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Almosthere: We will be reopening fire stations left right and centre, because we are bringing back fire marks and charging a fortune for each fire we attend AND we will go to false alarms, cos we want to keep the brothers and sisters in jobs, not like some of the miseryguts in the public fire and rescue services. It worked in Kurnal's day. When I say "we" obviously I dont mean Retters and I. Any time control calls, Retters will tell them to call back if it gets to 50 pumps and then pour me another shot of Talisker at the 24 hour Talisker bar.
You could of course develop the Dotty and Maniac Fire & Rescue Service to include pizza ordering and delivery. Imagine getting your Hawiian with extra pineapple delivered in a shiney red lorry with a complimentary full monty in the front room.
Anyway I blame the Talisker. Why oh why do they think that steeping a lump of turf in a bucket of a Glenfiddich for 6 weeks ......................?
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Thanks for that, I now understand the ramblings reason!
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It worked in Kurnal's day
Don't forget Sir Col that in his day horses used to pull the pump. I envisage a 21st Century alternative of remote control appliances and firefighting robots which can be controlled from one of those i-thingame tablet wotsit remote controller jobbies in the comfort of the Talisker Bar.
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Justaboutthere: how dare you insult the drink that paves the streets of england with gold as a result of its tax. It never dehydrates me like Bushmills does. I reckon Guinness is only os successful because they drink it to rehydrate themselves after the Bushmills.
Retters. fire-fighting robots? I like the cut of that jib. It has worked in the case of fire safety officers ever since 1 october 2006. Can we turn the top floor of Union Street into a gentlemans talisker bar.
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The private firms loom closer....
http://www.hantsfire.gov.uk/stories.htm?newsid=64369
Only a partnership but wedges & thin ends spring to mind...
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That company won the contract for emptying our dustbins last autumn. The local papers are full of complaints week after week.
Good job the fire service is not an emergency service with standards to meet any more.
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This came up on our local news:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-21524059
It seems Cleveland is jumping on the wagon as well.
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Michael, if you think that Retters and I are going to buy Cleveland you have another think coming. For a start, Retters couldnt even find Cleveland if you gave him a blank map of the UK. You can take the boy out of the West Mids, but you will never get west mids out of the boy. Oh no, we are only interested in met brigades. Furthermore, have you any idea, how long it would take Retters and I to get from Union Street to Cleveland even if we did have the faintest idea where it is. By the time we got to London Bridge, we would have no idea which way to point our FRS Bentleys.
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And to make a serious point regarding the potential privatisation of public services such as FRS
Michael, if you think that Retters and I are going to buy Cleveland you have another think coming. ...Oh no, we are only interested in met brigades.
An thereby hangs the problem. Businessmen (women) considering buying public assets will only ever be interested in profit and the devil to the hindmost.
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Colin
By the time we got to London Bridge, we would have no idea which way to point our FRS Bentleys.
North, back towards civilisation!
I think it would appeal to you set just between North Yorks and Tyneside, a little hobby fire brigade on your way back to Scotland.
Retters will have no problem with his accent, they can't understand it in London and they won't be able to understand it up there either.
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The problem with Scotland Michael is that the blighters in the Scottish fire and rescue services care a lot about the safety of the public and service to the community, and they will not be selling off the family jewels to Retters and me. Besides which, Retters and I would not like their policies of attending all calls to AFAs before the flames are spotted by a passer by coming out of the windows and the roof.
Retters and I dont want troubled by fires in sleeping risks until people have put theirs and others lives at risk by spending a hour or two frigging about and then phoning us to say that the place is burning to the ground and half the residents are trapped. Then, we might concede to turn out. We like the English system too much to head for scotland, except for our vacations, where retters has never worked out why, in H&I, they still fondly refer to the english tourists as febs.
You say this Kleevshire place is somewhere near T&W and North Yorks. These are both FRSs with whom I have enjoyed a good relationship. Would we be able to buy all three and then amalgamate them, making a few hundred people redundant in the process?
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You say this Kleevshire place is somewhere near T&W and North Yorks. These are both FRSs with whom I have enjoyed a good relationship. Would we be able to buy all three and then amalgamate them, making a few hundred people redundant in the process?
Colin,
I think you are beginning to get the idea. Look at the bigger picture, if you are buy these and London then you can steady acquire the remainder of the English Brigades. Standardisation of equipment, leading to increased purchasing power and lower costs, rationalisation of command structure etc. etc. There is a good training college up for sale as well!
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Sounds like Monopoly! But only of real benefit if you buy those that are linked together.
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Yes but like Monopoly you have to build your empire!
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I like the sound of this think big idea, Michael. However, all traning will be carried out at the real fire services college in scotland. The other one can be knocked down and used as retirement accommodation for all the chiefs we make redundant.
Do you remmeber when the computer industry rubbed their hands with glee as every little thiefdom of a fire brigade came and asked for tailor made command and control software, different from that of every other thiefdom. And can you remember the debacle of the system for the greatest fire brigade in the whole of london, soon to be renamed Rettrers and Toddys fire and pizza delivery service.
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Yes Colin, only be careful about the training in Scotland and knocking the other one down, otherwise when Scotland errects the border controls following independence, Toddy and Retters English Fire and Pizza Delivery Service (TV aerials and plumbing fixed) could be in political bother. Unless of course you are running it as an off sore company based in the Cayman Islands!
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Yes Colin, only be careful about the training in Scotland and knocking the other one down, otherwise when Scotland errects the border controls following independence, Toddy and Retters English Fire and Pizza Delivery Service (TV aerials and plumbing fixed) could be in political bother. Unless of course you are running it as an off sore company based in the Cayman Islands!
Do you think Mike that Hadrians Wall might be repaired and made a little higher? To keep them out or in as the case may be.
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Why not rebuild both Hadrian's Wall and the Antonine Wall, give us a bit of a buffer zone.
Mind you there are so many down here perhaps we ought to use the Welsh method as used on the Severn bridges, charge them to come into England but no charge to leave.
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Worry not. My good friends in the scottish fire and rescue services will always have a welcome for me and my english fire brigade, as scots never look down on those who, by birthright, are less fortunate than themselves. And they will wlcome Retters as my friend, particularly as they wont know what he is saying and he doesnt know what a feb is.
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Worry not. My good friends in the scottish fire and rescue services will always have a welcome for me and my english fire brigade, as scots never look down on those who, by birthright, are less fortunate than themselves. And they will wlcome Retters as my friend, particularly as they wont know what he is saying and he doesnt know what a feb is.
Do you think they might see him as your pet Martian?
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Dunno what you mean Nearlyhere.
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He means that martians speak better english than you, Retters, were taught at Bordersley Green Academy for young gentlefolk.