Exit Signage

[Phillip L]

Can anyone tell me if there is a difference in the direction that the arrow points for going through and straight ahead when the European and British standard signs are compared?

[fred]

The very fact that you have to ask that question indicates that something has gone very wrong with the guidance and standards that apply.

A sensible quote in BS 5499-4 is

"To avoid confusion, all signs within a system of escape route signing should be of similar style, design, size
and format."

As a matter of interest upward pointing signs can have three meanings :-

1. Progress forward from here, or

2.  Progress forward and through from here; when sign is sited above a door, or

3. Progress forward and up from here

Surprisingly downward pointing signs actually mean 'Progress down from here"

So 'going down' at least is a piece of cake ....

[PhilHallmark]

Can anyone tell me if there is a difference in the direction that the arrow points for going through and straight ahead when the European and British standard signs are compared?

In directional terms, no the arrow is the same:pointing up; However in sign design the "Euro design" is confusing to many as is is not a clear indication of what the sign is meant to portray.

What I find annoying is the E/Lighting manufacturers do not even produce a "Euro sign" with an arrow pointing up. The majority only have the arrow pointing down - in their sales brochures and through the distributor network. You ask a CEF dealer if he has a BS5499 standard MoE sign and you are faced with blank looks.

So not only are end users and tenants faced with often incorrect means of escape E/L signage throughout their premises, the signs they do have installed are the incorrect arrow direction and of the "Euro design" - personally I only advise BS5499-4:2000 design.

In answer to your original question, the European version is ideal if you are looking for a large fridge but not a Fire Exit.

[fireftrm]

Up arrow (as in pointing to the top of the sign) is made by all the manufacturers to my knowledge. It is meant to mean straight on, as can down arrow, as opposed to the diagonal down that can be used to show go down a level. So down can be the down arrow (straight down from here (maybe top of  a stair, or when at a door that goes to a stair). This can also mean go through this door if above it, for example. The diuagonal down (points tot he left or right corner of the sign) is the one that really only means you go down a level(s). The up one is for placing on a door or to show the route as this way .........

[jokar]

Isn't it stange, pictograms were supposed to make signs that much clearer, instead they have confused the issue.  I would far rather have the arrows removed and have the man in the fridge, at least we know that you have to go through the door

[kurnal]

You are right Graeme
Very often the arrow is used to point to the door, rather than the direction you take after passing through the door.

Then theres the the situation in a room where almost immediately after passing out of an exit from the room  the route enters a long corridor with a staircase immediately left or right. Should the sign in the room point  up or to the left?
I put a sign up in the room above the door without any arrow. I was told I was was wrong as it was not a final exit.
So someone else put up one with an up arrow. People now go straight ahead along the dead end corridor missing the exit staircase  on the left.
So someone else says it should have an arrow to the left above the room exit. Trouble is theres a store room door immediately to the left of the exit from the room.

Think I will hide in the fridge.

[Ken Taylor]

Sometimes I think that it was simpler when we had either 'To fire exit' or 'Fire exit' - in red.

[Richard Earl]

as far as i have been told, if you go streight on through a door the arrow points UP, then another arrow is located to give continuous cues to the escape , this may be in a form of suspended signs, the only time i fit a fire exit arrow down, if not above a stair well after the door, is if a up stair well is on the other side of the door and may confuse people.

hope this is clear if not email me
richard.earl@tecservuk.com

[wee brian]

So long as the escape route is obvious then it doesn't really matter.

Its when the escape route gets convalouted and confusing that you really need to think.

[ian gough]

I agree Wee B. I often think we have far too many signs in buildings that are simply a waste of money.

[PhilHallmark]

Standard MoE signage is available to cover all directions, the signs I was refering to were the Emergency Lighing signs. Having checked in a couple of manufacturers brochures, I can be pretty sure these are not produced with an arrow pointing up apart from when the kit is supplied with a sticker kit. The only problem with these is usually the installer is not aware of the BS requirements and is used to seeing Emergeny Lights with arrow down above doors as they have installed E/L with fixed legends (supplied with arrow down) on the cover before.

Standard Rigid Plastic and Self Adhesive type of signs are widely available to BS5499-4:2000 and more often than not installed following the fire equipment annual service following an engineers' recommendation.

When a door has another door immediately behind it and an option is presented whether to turn left, right or straight on, the BS recommendation is to place a directional fire exit sign above the second door to indicate which direction to follow. This aviods all confusion of a "T" junction scenario.

Suspended ceiling signs are a very good option and not used often enough. One problem can be where a site has multiple sales or promotion signs hanging down. Common sense and a chat with the owner can usually be the best answer.

[jokar]

In a very large M&S store near me, they have so many signs that confusion reigns, no claer pathways to exit and lets hope nothing occurs because chaos will ensue.

[Jim Creak]

I am really surprised yet again that professionals that talk at great length about competence and qualification to comment on fire safety matters do not know basic means of escape signing provision.

I hope I get the chance to test your opinions in a court of law. I will change your flippancy into major liability.

It is of no consequence what you think about British or International standards they ARE the current test, bench mark for best practice if you feel they need revision then make a technical proposal.

For your information ISO 16069 and ISO 7010 are the International Standard... World wide not just Euro land has the same meaning for directional arrow as does the British Standard BS5499 Part 4 2000 Why? because the technical committees( 72 Professional Bodies) understood that escape route identification and directional guidance requires world wide harmonisation.

There is no such thing as European Standard for Escape route signs. This has been made up by the Emegency Lighting Industry cobbled together from illustrations in a 1977 EC Directive with no technical credentials at all. In fact ICEL withdrew technical support for this symbol years ago. Guess what!! on the basis that no one understood them.

As you might guess from my tone this is of importance to me as I have for the last 20 years studied the after effects of evacuation, escape ,egress behaviour and wayguidance principles research and tragedy to help develop best practice to save lives.

Why don.t you buy the Standards so that you can comment with competence. Then you could answer the valid question with a degree of knowledge.

[kurnal]

That would be interesting Jim.
I generally use your book as my bible.

You are right though that the industry is in a mess on signage. Its ok quoting the ISO standards- not one official document will point the reader to them. And even the HSE website and leaflets give poor and very outdated advice.
Most sales catalogues offer a range of styles of sign with minimal explanation or guidance.  One supplier says that text is mandatory on an exit sign.

Clearly we have a duty to give best advice which in most cases involves following codes of practice and standards. But its the regulations that are mandatory, not the guidance, and sometimes its necessary to vary the guidance following the principles of prevention, in order to satisfy the requirement.

[Tom Sutton]

Jim I agree professionals should understand the ISO, British and Euro standards on signs but what is of more concern to me, is does joe public understand.