It never ceases to amaze me that otherwise sane and rational people still come out with this twaddle about leaving disabled people to die pending arrival of the fire brigade, assuming that they do actually come under their RIP (sorry freudian slip IRMP) policies. No wonder disabled people get bolshie. Contrary to the reported views of Glen Hoddle, disabled people are just ordinary people, the safety of whom must be ensured by those responsible for the safety of their able bodied colleagues. It is not the role of the fire brigade to get them out. If you really do need evidence of some kind, try basic morality, but if this fails to convince try the fundamental definiton of means of escape, or as a last resort look at BS 5588-8, imperfect though it may be.
Colin,
This is what annoys me about you
Yes ok you are right people do not think about disabled (sorry "less abled" )enough but "Santas Little Helper" is looking for advice not some silly critiscism or belittling from you. Do you talk to your clients in such a tone I wonder?
For all we know he may be new to the fire safety field and looking for sensible advice NOT wise cracks about how silly he is and how "tut tut heaven forbid thats not how we fire safety professionals deal with it".
Colin you contribute greatly to these forums but at times you make some very snobbish, pompous, ill thought remarks.
This forum is to help people not belittle them Colin and co.
In answer to your question Santa's Little Helper....
The Fire Service are not responsible for the evacuation of anyone abled or less abled - tit is the employer's duty to do that.
The Fire Service has a duty to rescue people, however this is a completely different subject matter. The term "Rescue" infers that someone must be in a life threatening situation requiring the immediate intervention by the fire brigade.
A less abled / mobility impaired person sat in a refuge isn't someone whom requires rescue, they are certainly not in a life threatening situation unless of course somehow the fire has spread into the refuge area which would be extremely rare.
My advice is contact your local Fire Authority again, and ask for some input from them. They should send out an officer to look at your premises and come up with some options or suggestions on how to resolve the issue of evacuating the less abled. They won't do all the leg work for you but they should explain enough for you to formulate a plan.
If you still feel the situation is bewildering it may be worth considering employing the services of someone like Colin Todd an experienced and competent fire safety consultant whom has alot of experience in this field.
We use evac chairs at our establishment for self transfering mobility impaired persons.
For non self transfering persons we use lifts to bring them down to ground floor, even though the lifts aren't proper evacuation lifts. Because they are not proper evacuation lifts we undertake an "on the spot" risk assessment during an incident to ascertain if the fire or emergency threatens the use of the lift. If it doesnt then we use the lift.
The practice of using lifts would be snubbed by some of my colleagues in the fire safety profession however before they barrage me with negative comments telling me how silly and dangerous and deplorable that is I can confirm that the fire Authority are more than happy for us to operate this procedure.Its commmon sense at the end of the day.
But "Oh " I hear some of my colleagues cry "Bloomin fire officers haven't a clue they aren't proper risk assessed motivated people with leters from the IFE after their name. They are too used to prescriptive law"
Well our fire authorty employs civilian inspecting officers whom do have experience in not only advanced fire safety but also general health and safety and so the risk based approach is something they have evolved with.
Hope this helps
