The competence of external maintenance contractors

[hammer1]

While doing a property FRA this week, I came across a national company who must have a annual income of 8-10 million, on site conducting an audit as they were instructed to complete the weekly MCP tests and the required E/L tests. However to my shock the person who would of been doing the tests has no experience or knowledge of the various BS.

Now there are a few of these contractors that cater for unmanned sites and provide this 'service' and you normally find very little if any info in the fire log books of what type of maintenance has been undertaken. For example what E/L have been tested and to what standard, no info on the drain down of E/L systems, stating only 25% of fire alarm system has been completed on quarterly checks and with no relevant info to ensure the required checks are covered over the 12 months.

They and the others sometimes offer full maintenance of the fire alarm system, but sub-contract the work to who knows.

What I have found that a lot of fire inspectors do not really go into looking into that the correct type of maintenance is in place and by a competent person and only will glance at the fire log books.

Surely this is a worrying area which is not being fully scrutinised or regulated to the correct levels.

Any fire alarm system, emergency lighting system and associated systems are as good as it maintenance regime, a simple tick box on a fire log book suggests nothing.

[Nearlybaldandgrey]

As a regulator, I do look into the maintenance of the fire precautions as part of an audit. It's OK for the RP to state they do regular tests, but it's better supported by evidence which does include the engineers reports.

I have seen some very poor reports which state the item you have mentioned Hammer. Defects are identified such as '3 E/L units not working - repaired' which gives no information. as the RP pays for this, I advise them to insisit on a comprehensive report stating the location of the units, the fault and the work needed to sort it out, which I don't think is unreasonable.

I also advise them to check the credability of the engineers and their qualifiactions. To my mind, if an engineer is properly qualified, then they will be familiar with the British Standards and carry out test and maintenance in line with them.

[Benzerari]

While doing a property FRA this week, I came across a national company who must have a annual income of 8-10 million, on site conducting an audit as they were instructed to complete the weekly MCP tests and the required E/L tests. However to my shock the person who would of been doing the tests has no experience or knowledge of the various BS.

Now there are a few of these contractors that cater for unmanned sites and provide this 'service' and you normally find very little if any info in the fire log books of what type of maintenance has been undertaken. For example what E/L have been tested and to what standard, no info on the drain down of E/L systems, stating only 25% of fire alarm system has been completed on quarterly checks and with no relevant info to ensure the required checks are covered over the 12 months.

They and the others sometimes offer full maintenance of the fire alarm system, but sub-contract the work to who knows.

What I have found that a lot of fire inspectors do not really go into looking into that the correct type of maintenance is in place and by a competent person and only will glance at the fire log books.

Surely this is a worrying area which is not being fully scrutinised or regulated to the correct levels.

Any fire alarm system, emergency lighting system and associated systems are as good as it maintenance regime, a simple tick box on a fire log book suggests nothing.

I agree that fire alarm log-books are not fully completed whether maintenance is done properly or not, and by a competent fire alarm Engineer (Not Person) or not... etc, in my opinion those issues may be overcome only if the fire alarm system itself is upgraded to be Integrated system; you may also call it Data Management Fire Alarm System which record every single task and by the name of the operator or engineer in charge, and that days the fire officer would just require a print out from the system to check what is what..., also the service engineer can access previous record to find out what has or hasn't been tested... 

[kurnal]

Why should this be any more reliable than a paper log book Benz? Where I have seen this tried it falls down if the engineer cannot access the computer files due to password issues or IT failure. Plus there can be a lack of accountability unless each person has their own log in string.....and then new engineers come along and cannot sign in....I say keep it simple.

[AnthonyB]

In my FRAs I find it as important to try and ascertain the competence of the maintainers as it is to have maintenance done at all. Otherwise there will be a false sense of security which can all end in tears.

You don't have to be a subject specialist to find the worst either - although extinguisher forms feel the brunt as it's my specialism, my general EL & Alarm knowledge is enough to detect the worst omissions or short-cuts.

Some people are of the opinion that is doesn't matter if they are poor as long as they get the proof of maintenance as they can blame the contractor if it all goes wrong, but that's hardly reducing risk and preventing harm!

[Benzerari]

Why should this be any more reliable than a paper log book Benz? Where I have seen this tried it falls down if the engineer cannot access the computer files due to password issues or IT failure. Plus there can be a lack of accountability unless each person has their own log in string.....and then new engineers come along and cannot sign in....I say keep it simple.

FAS is actually simple as long as it detects fires and alarms an output signal, and that's initially the job meant to be done. But; this is only part of loads of fire safety aspects which are still kept separate or neglected despite their importance. But if those aspects (including service operations and fire events…) are integrated and recorded in a database style, this would be very useful for service engineers and fire officers... etc, subsequently any new engineer or operator in charge of the system would be assigned a password which is related to his Ident..., if done in this way the electronic fire alarm log book will accurately be filled up..., one issue I strongly believe could be effectively monitored is the false alarms types and rates... etc

I think data management technology is a well established field and just hasn't yet seen the light within fire safety.

[David Rooney]

Whatever happened to ...

"Periodic inspection and servicing needs to be carried out by a competent person with specialist knowledge of
fire detection and alarm systems, including knowledge of the causes of false alarms, sufficient information
regarding the system, and adequate access to spares."

It seems the RRFSO, BAFE, LPS etc still haven't managed to prevent plumbers, so called electricians or anyone else who want to jumpon the band wagon from signing backs of cigarette packets and convincing the end user he's getting his moneys worth from his £250 a year service contract.....

[Galeon]

Why should this be any more reliable than a paper log book Benz? Where I have seen this tried it falls down if the engineer cannot access the computer files due to password issues or IT failure. Plus there can be a lack of accountability unless each person has their own log in string.....and then new engineers come along and cannot sign in....I say keep it simple.

FAS is actually simple as long as it detects fires and alarms an output signal, and that's initially the job meant to be done. But; this is only part of loads of fire safety aspects which are still kept separate or neglected despite their importance. But if those aspects (including service operations and fire events…) are integrated and recorded in a database style, this would be very useful for service engineers and fire officers... etc, subsequently any new engineer or operator in charge of the system would be assigned a password which is related to his Ident..., if done in this way the electronic fire alarm log book will accurately be filled up..., one issue I strongly believe could be effectively monitored is the false alarms types and rates... etc

I think data management technology is a well established field and just hasn't yet seen the light within fire safety.

Good point Benz ,
Slight drawback some of the planks I have had the misfortune to encounter , have enough trouble working on standard conventional systems , let along trying to use a lappy or pda .

[Galeon]

Whatever happened to ...

"Periodic inspection and servicing needs to be carried out by a competent person with specialist knowledge of
fire detection and alarm systems, including knowledge of the causes of false alarms, sufficient information
regarding the system, and adequate access to spares."

It seems the RRFSO, BAFE, LPS etc still haven't managed to prevent plumbers, so called electricians or anyone else who want to jumpon the band wagon from signing backs of cigarette packets and convincing the end user he's getting his moneys worth from his £250 a year service contract.....

Try servicing a boiler without a gas safe cert , our industry needs a good kicking .