Regional Controls

[ohdeer]

Matt McDonald document re the above can now be accessed off of the ODPM web site.

Look under Fire

then under New National Frame work.

 :cry:

[Guest]

Re Regional Controls
I'm trying to get opinions on regional controls.  My control is going to be regionalised within the next couple of years and I'd be interested to hear from any Control Operators from controls which have already regionalised or are going to.  Are they the way forward, or will they be too big and will we lose all local knowledge etc.

[Guest]

may i suggest you get in touch with your fbu rep asap.

the fbu response to the mott mcdonald report will be published shortly, and i urge you to read it.

there have been national seminars and workshops, and regional seminars run by the fbu in relation to regionalisation of controls.

[Guest]

Only last week i saw an item on the national news albeit a fairly brief one about how centralised Coastguard controls might be contributing to increases in fatalities in those areas under the control of the new centralised Coastguard control centres. Don't know too much but the findings were as the result of a bona fide review into the performance of the Coastguard service. You may wish to contact someone at the Coastguard service media office for further details of the review. I definately felt that there were parallels between what has already happened there and what is proposed for the Fire Service.

[fireftrm]

We have now had at least three regional management boards rejecting propsals for their controls, where does leave the ODPM's plans?

[dave bev]

defying logic one would assume?

[dave bev]

oh, and with an extremely large bill for consultancy fees! if only they'd tell us what it is really costing, still at least theyre brave enough to be saying 'it will cost in the region of' - just how big is a region i wonder? could a region equate to the same size as a brigade might do currently?

ps, judging by the fees being paid perhaps not all consultants live hand to mouth as colin 'cratchet' todd does!

[dave bev]

Conservative Party

Press Release

25 Victoria Street, London, SW1H 0DL

Tel (Press): 020 7984 8121

Tel (Broadcast Desk): 020 7984 8100

Fax: 020 7984 8272

www.conservatives.com
 CONSERVATIVE
 
 

10th August 2005

Ref:2069/05
 

 

John Prescott's new regional fire quangos threaten safety
999 calls now to be answered hundreds of miles away
 

Conservatives today attacked the announcement by John Prescott's Department to shut down local fire control rooms and replace them with distant regional structures. This could allow cuts to be made to local fire services without any input from local people, and means that 999 calls will be answered hundreds of miles away - by calls centres staffed by operators who have no knowledge at all of the local area. The restructuring process will cost a massive £72 million, re-diverting resources away from frontline protection.

 

Caroline Spelman MP, Shadow Secretary of State for Local Government & Communities explained,

 

"Despite the rejection of regional government in November's North East referendum, John Prescott is moving ahead with expensive plans for more regional quangos. This will mean the local fire control rooms will be shut down. Decisions on staffing and local fire stations now face being made or influenced at a regional level, allowing unaccountable bureaucrats to shut down fire stations, irrespective of local wishes.

 

"A regional structure will put lives at risk, since 999 operators will have less knowledge of a local area. A typical government office region covers up to 8 million people. Civil resilience will be damaged by placing 'all the eggs in one basket'. If the regional centre is forced offline by a disaster or attack, the whole emergency response will go down across a massive geographical area.

 

"Conservatives believe that fire and rescue authorities must remain accountable to local people, rather than to unwanted regional quangos. John Prescott's regional empire building is playing politics with fire safety."

 

ENDS

For further information, please contact Amy Fisher on 020 7984 8088.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Notes to Editors

 

The locations of the regional fire control rooms were announced by the ODPM on 10 August 2005.

http://www.odpm.gov.uk/pns/DisplayPN.cgi?pn_id=2005_0168

 

Eight new regional control centres will replace the existing 46 local fire service control rooms across the country. The locations of the seven named sites are:

* Belmont Business Park, Durham

* Lingley Mere Business Park, Great Sankey, Warrington, Cheshire * Cambridge Research Park, Cambridge * Willow Farm Business Park, Castle Donington, Leicestershire * Wolverhampton Business Park, Wolverhampton * Paragon Business Village, Wakefield, West Yorkshire * Blackbrook Business Park, Taunton, Somerset.

 

The South East site has yet to be finalised.

 

Regionalisation of the fire service

 

Following the Government's Fire & Rescue Services Act 2004, all local fire authorities in England have been allocated to one of the nine Government Office regions, and have been required to form a Regional Management Board. The Government originally planned that in the event of an elected regional assembly being established, these Management Boards would become regional fire authorities. The Government has told the Management Boards to scrap their existing local control rooms and create a single Regional Control Room in each region.

  More information: http://www.lga.gov.uk/ProjectHome.asp?lsection=59&ccat=958

 

The Government have stated this will cost £72 million:

"The estimated total net cost to public funds of delivering a national network of nine regional control centres (RCC) for England is approximately £72 million. This covers the costs of setting up the new fire control centres from the start of the project in January 2004 until the last RCC goes live during FY 2008-09" (Hansard, 3 March 2005, col. 1325W).

 

The Fire Brigades Union have warned that the regionalisation moves will "cost lives"

http://www.fbu.org.uk/newspress/pressrelease/2005/03_18.php (FBU press release, 18 March 2005).

http://www.fbu.org.uk/newspress/pressrelease/2005/01_24.php (FBU press release, 24 January 2005).

 

Population and area of each Government Office Region

 

 
 Population
 Area (Sq km)
 
North East
 2,513,000
 8,573
 
North West
 6,771,000
 14,106
 
South East
 8,037,000
 19,069
 
South West
 4,960,000
 23,837
 
West Midlands
 5,304,000
 12,998
 
East of England
 5,420,000
 19,110
 
East Midlands
 4,216,000
 15,607
 
Yorkshire and the Humber
 4,983,000
 15,408
 

(source: Office for National Statistics, Regional Trends 38, 2004 edition)

 

Locations and staff numbers of existing control rooms in England outside London

 

Current control rooms
 Staff employed (full-time equivalents)
 
East of England: six control rooms
 
Kempston, Bedford
 25
 
Huntingdon
 31
 
Hutton (Essex)
 44
 
Hertford
 24
 
Heathersett, Norwich
 26
 
Ipswich
 23
 
 
 
East Midlands: five control rooms
 
Littleover, Derby
 29
 
Glenfield, Leicester
 31
 
Lincoln
 24
 
Northampton
 26
 
Arnold, Nottingham
 25
 
 
 
North East: four control rooms
 
Hartlepool
 25
 
Durham
 28
 
Morpeth
 20
 
Newcastle upon Tyne
 40
 
 
 
North West: five control rooms
 
Winsford
 27
 
Cockermouth
 19
 
Swinton, Manchester
 65
 
Fulwood, Preston
 43
 
Bootle, Liverpool
 58
 
 
 
South East: nine control rooms
 
Tilehurst, Reading
 34
 
Aylesbury
 20
 
Eastbourne
 26
 
Eastleigh
 38
 
Newport (Isle of Wight)
 12
 
Tovil, Maidstone
 39
 
Kidlington, Oxford
 22
 
Reigate
 29
 
Chichester
 28
 
 
 
South West: seven control rooms
 
Bristol
 32
 
Truro
 16
 
Clyst St. George, Exeter
 31
 
Dorchester
 23
 
Quedgeley, Gloucester
 23
 
Cheddon Fitzpaine, Taunton
 19
 
Potterne, Devizes
 22
 
 
 
West Midlands: five control rooms
 
Worcester
 21
 
Shrewsbury
 16
 
Stone
 33
 
Royal Leamington Spa
 18
 
Birmingham
 65
 
 
 
Yorkshire and the Humber: four control rooms
 
Kingston upon Hull
 28
 
Northallerton
 22
 
Sheffield
 39
 
Birkenshaw, West Yorkshire
 51
 

 

(Hansard, 21 December 2004, col. 1560W)

http://www.publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm200405/cmhansrd/cm041221/text/41221w12.htm

 

 

Conservative Action Plan

 

Conservatives have outlined alternative proposals to boost civil resilience:

 

1.         Scrap Regional Management Boards: We will scrap Regional Management Boards and return their powers to the existing, local and democratically accountable fire and rescue authorities. Fire and rescue authorities may wish to 'cluster' on the basis of operationally logical groupings, in order to generate savings (e.g. on procurement) which can free up more money for frontline protection. But this process must be 'bottom-up' not 'top down' with central government's role being to encourage and support, not dictate and define.

 

2.         Halt the regionalisation of Fire Control Rooms: We will halt the process of replacement of the 45 existing local brigade control rooms with 8 Regional Fire Control Centres and commission an urgent review of control and mobilisation procedures - led by the fire and rescue authorities.

 

3.         Strengthen disaster response capacity while maintaining local accountability: We recognise the need for nationwide coordination to ensure an effective response to a major national disaster. We believe such preparedness can best be assured by fostering active collaboration between fire brigades, rather than via creating new regional quangos.

 

ENDS

 

Promoted by Gavin Barwell on behalf of the Conservative Party, at 25 Victoria Street, London, SW1H 0DL Printed by the Conservative Party.

[dave bev]

fbu press release


10 August 2005  
Today’s government decision on fire control centres is “wasteful and dangerous.”

This morning (10 August) the government is to announce plans which will make Britain’s fire service less effective and more expensive, says Fire Brigades Union President Ruth Winters.

Its plan to create nine Regional Control Rooms in England instead of the present 46 is forecast to cost £44 million in consultancy fees alone. “£44 million would pay for an extra 1,400 firefighters who could save lives” says Ms Winters. “Or it would pay for a major boost to community fire safety, or for initiatives to reduce arson. It is money that could save lives.

“Instead the money is being used to line the pockets of yet more consultants to allow them to chase yet another technology rainbow, using untested technology. And to find the money, the new scheme will ensure that there are fewer staff to deal with more calls from the public – as calls have been increasing every year.

“And consultants may cost far more than £44 million. The estimate has soared by nearly £13 million since April, when it stood at £31.3 million. Experience must surely have taught the government that these estimates always go up, never down.

“To do this at any time would be dangerous and irresponsible. But to gamble with the efficiency of the fire service at a time when the threat of terrorism makes its efficiency a matter of life and death for all of us is almost criminally irresponsible.

“The announcement will be made this morning as quietly as possible in the hope that no one will notice. 219 MPs backed an Early Day Motion promoted by the Fire Brigades Union which called on the government to rethink the control centres project. Ministers have known that this was their intention for some months, but decided to announce it in the middle of the holiday season, when the House of Commons was not sitting, in the hope that no one would notice.”

[colin todd]

Davey,  You know how I hate to argue with the brothers, and, of course, Ruthie, having been con op herself, must surely be a leading expert on economics. English readers will also be gratified that she did not refer to the monies involved as '' Ra dosh''.  However, could you give Ruthie the very best wishes of a fellow countryman, and ask her if she could clarify a few perplexities of a mere lay observer?
1. Why will the regionalisation make the fire brigade more expensive to operate? Once she explains this to me, I will be right there alongside her, assuming exit widths permit and that I am convinced.

2. You know this £44million that would pay for 1,400 firefighters? Ruthie did not mention, and I fear my maths is not good enough to compute, how long the £44million would keep the 1,400 firefighters going, complete with pensions, uniforms, facilities big red lorries, Biro pens, etc. Is it for their entire fire service career. She does know, I assume, that the brother consultants will not be paid that every year for the next 30 years doesnt she?

3. Could we just understand (forgiving my complete ignorance of anything technical and comms-based) what the untested technology is. Presumably, it is some new fangled gadget (possibly invented by yet another damn Scotsman) called The Telephone??? If so, I agree, it will never work. The control operators will spend their time talking to people  in call centres in India selling fitted kitchens, as thats the majority of the calls I get. Though, hang on a sec!!! When I book Hilton hotels, I always end up talking to someone in Estonia. (gives me an excellent opportunity to try out my Russian, but they never seem to understand it and want to talk in perfect bloody English!). So if Paris's old man can make that work, would it not be possible to enable 999 callers in Auchtermuchty to talk to a wee girl in Glesgie. (aka Glasgow).

I await the enlightenment of my Sister.

[Goodsparks]

LOL,
Surely in todays age of GPS, vehicle tracking, improved comms etc it wouldn`t make the slightest difference where in the world the control room was. Databases must surely exist about specific buildings and risks. access issues etc that could all be forwarded directly to 'the big red lorry' and the boys and girls at the sharp end.

Im assuming the Amalgamations will cause control room job cuts, maybe the monies saved on control room staff salarys could be spent on front line firefighters?

Paul

[colin todd]

Oh really, I see, golly gosh. Does that make it Sparky 1 Ruthie 0 on this issue. One might ask if you are a ''Brother'' Sparky. If so, remember careless talk costs lives! Come the revolution, you do not want the sinister knock on the door at the dead of night!

[dave bev]

colin and sparky - would you be so kind as to read the fbu respons to the flawed mott macdonald report. it is available from the fbu web site. all your questions and queeries will be answered.

at the same time you may wish to start asking questions of the govt of failed and costly 'it' projects.

dave bev

[Goodsparks]

LOL,
Nah, not a brother i`m afraid (though sounds like a good job really, wake up with a burning brazier on my doorstep)

Didn`t mean to cause any offence, just picked up on the tail end of somebody elses comments..Ill get back in my box now...sorry


Paul
Now where did i park my green goddess :-) ??

[colin todd]

Davey, My time is a bit short at the mo, as I am about to go on hols. Could Ruthie not just give me the precis, by answering the above questions----or is the FBU unable to answer simple questions about statements they make????Surely should not be difficult if the assertions in the statement constitute more than hot air?