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Fire Alarm Systems / Can a fire alarm sounder be TOO LOUD?
« Last post by bigblockofcheese on February 03, 2024, 10:05:21 AM »
Can a fire alarm sounder be TOO loud?

I'm at a school in the UK, and there's a small staff bathroom (2.5m x 4m) that contains a toilet, cubicle shower and a sink. This room has a Banshee Excel sounder on the ceiling, positioned around 1 metre from the ears of a person using the toilet.

https://hbl.co.uk/app/uploads/2022/07/IS62-Banshee-Excel.pdf

The other day there was a fire alarm, and a person had literally just "committed" on the toilet when the alarm sounded. This meant they needed to spend 1-2 minutes finishing the "job" / cleaning up before being able to leave the room, during which time they were subjected to the full power of the alarm sounding 1m away from their ears.

They've subsequently pointed out that the sounder itself, at this close proximity and in this small a room, could represent its own risk of auditory injury and I think they may have a point.

The UK regulations recommend sounders are a minimum of 65db or 5db above ambient room noise (though apparently running water from showers can be disregarded).

I cannot work out what the sound level from this sounder would be at a 1m distance, for 1-2 minutes, and if this could indeed be dangerous. Can anyone advise?

I note that the RNID state that "for sounds of 110?120dB, even a very short exposure time can cause hearing damage."

Any thoughts appreciated!
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Technical Advice / Re: Ancillary part
« Last post by wee brian on December 14, 2023, 05:11:02 PM »
Well - I think it would be daft to have a compartment wall between the kitchen and the restaurant. But there are means of escape considerations in ADB.
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Q & A / Re: Perko closers
« Last post by AnthonyB on December 07, 2023, 07:51:32 PM »
If a block of a size, occupancy & layout where notional doors generally are acceptable in guidance - where a modern FD30/30S doorset would be expected even in an existing build I might be minded to take a more conservative approach.
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Q & A / Re: Perko closers
« Last post by Collegeboy on December 07, 2023, 10:30:27 AM »
Thanks Anthony
So you`d leave them in if they work ok with advice to phase out, as in no Definitive need to change out ?
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Q & A / Re: Perko closers
« Last post by AnthonyB on December 06, 2023, 08:46:43 PM »
Considering that they have been frowned upon in guidance such as that produced by the Guild of Architectural Ironmongers for over 30 years due to not being adjustable and prone to failure I was surprised the Government Guides didn't deprecate them, but they only specifically mentioned rising butt hinges.

Most fail the Section 10 basic checks as they fail to overcome the latch at either fully open or 15 degree open so get recommended to be replaced by an EN1154 closer anyway - for those that pass I still point out their issues and suggest phasing out as they fail.

What doesn't help is the fact that they can be found used on post 2000 & even post 2010 builds when you would have thought they should have known better than to fit them (even where an overhead closer cannot be fitted, there are EN1154 approved adjustable double cam/chain versions of the Perko they could use, but they stick to the cheap single chain version)
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Q & A / Perko closers
« Last post by Collegeboy on December 06, 2023, 04:58:38 PM »
Probably been asked hundreds of times over the years,but whats the latest on single chain perkos on older type doors, Should they be replaced for overhead closers or ok to leave if still there and still working  ???  obviously not conforming to Controlled closer, EN1154, minimum power size etc, just asking whether to advise Replace or ok to leave as they conformed at the time of installation and replacement not retrospective  ??? 
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Fire related queries from non specialists / Re: Fire Door Keep Shut signage
« Last post by AnthonyB on December 03, 2023, 11:03:33 PM »
Are they self closing fire doors & if so do they need to be?

The Government Guides for dead ends usually give the option of fire doors onto the corridor (so they would need to be self closing and fire doors and  signed) or detection in every room (in which case they don't need to self close, be fire doors or be signed)
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Fire related queries from non specialists / Fire Door Keep Shut signage
« Last post by Collegeboy on December 03, 2023, 01:33:50 PM »
In a corridor approx 7m in length with small offices off of the corridor, would the office doors need Fire Door Keep shut signage,
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Technical Advice / Re: Ancillary part
« Last post by lyledunn on November 20, 2023, 09:14:00 PM »
Well, let?s say any of the four nations of the U.K. that you might be familiar with.
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Technical Advice / Re: Ancillary part
« Last post by wee brian on November 17, 2023, 01:31:38 PM »
Are you talking ADB or somewhere else?
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